Win the scottish cup and qualify for CL

Monty_greenock34

Monty_greenock34

Well-Known Member
The players owe us at the very least them two achievements.

I think if we win the cup and qualified from a favourable draw to get the champions league money this season is quickly forgotten about.

First things first though is win the cup and then we hopefully see a clearout.

Im very much the optimist but if we dont win cup or qualify for CL its going to be another long season next season.
 
I don't think the Scottish cup has any relevance to next season. The reality is that Celtic are a much better team than us currently with their tails up so every chance we take a sore one in the final. Next season there are no excuses. Clement has had 7 months in post and should have everything in place to go into pre season with his own players. I just hope we don't do our usual of waiting until august to get half the new players in.

In terms of champions league, it will be a difficult task to get into it but isn't insurmountable.
 
The vermin were there for the taking this season.

Confidence was near zero. Losing at home to Hearts, dropping points against the likes of Motherwell and Kilmarnock.

Had we escaped serious loss to injury, especially up front, we'd have spent long enough on the front foot to save that rickety defence from coming under anywhere near as much pressure.

Similarly, had our scouting/recruitment been a little better, and the board had pushed the boat out a little more, we'd also likely have had two in the bag by now.

We'd have scored more, and we'd have conceded less.

CL place would've been in the bag, and a treble would've been a very distinct possibility.
 
Our midfield is vastly inferior to theirs, that is undeniable and nothing to do with surrendering or any such nonsense.
Watching Lundstram floundering about trying to get close to their midfield 3 or even Forrest was cringeworthy.
Big Phil is going to have to pull off some sort of masterstroke to beat them next Saturday.
Let's hope he can do it.
As for the CL, it's impossible to comment as not one of us know what our squad will look like by then.
 
SIRBLUE said:
Our midfield is vastly inferior to theirs, that is undeniable and nothing to do with surrendering or any such nonsense.
Watching Lundstram floundering about trying to get close to their midfield 3 or even Forrest was cringeworthy.
Big Phil is going to have to pull off some sort of masterstroke to beat them next Saturday.
Let's hope he can do it.
As for the CL, it's impossible to comment as not one of us know what our squad will look like by then.
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Midfield has had an immense weight placed upon it.

Defensive midfielders have been bailing out the back four.

Complete lack of wide attacking players has left them without options either side.
 
SM™ said:
Midfield has had an immense weight placed upon it.

Defensive midfielders have been bailing out the back four.

Complete lack of wide attacking players has left them without options either side.
Click to expand...

I think the spine of the team is a major problem, the reality is their best center back is better than ours, their best midfielder is better than ours and their best striker is better than ours. We have a better goalkeeper who has made a difference, God knows where we would of been without him.
 
club175 said:
I don't think the Scottish cup has any relevance to next season. The reality is that Celtic are a much better team than us currently with their tails up so every chance we take a sore one in the final. Next season there are no excuses. Clement has had 7 months in post and should have everything in place to go into pre season with his own players. I just hope we don't do our usual of waiting until august to get half the new players in.

In terms of champions league, it will be a difficult task to get into it but isn't insurmountable.
Click to expand...
It does have relevance in the fact we have beat them in a meaningful game which kicks on to next season but Clement needs to get rid of all the old guard no exceptions
 
SM™ said:
Midfield has had an immense weight placed upon it.

Defensive midfielders have been bailing out the back four.

Complete lack of wide attacking players has left them without options either side.
Click to expand...

This is where I question PC shoehorning Silva out left, and worse Sterling out right.

In my opinion, we should've been raiding the youth team to plug these gaps and kept players in their own positions. Silva rotating with Dessers if necessary, and Sterling in midfield. We've been a shapeless mess for weeks now with too many players playing an unfamiliar position. What about that made anyone expect any consistency?

Hindsight is brilliant and all that and I'm certainly no football manager but I'm puzzled over all this.
 
Myogi said:
I think the spine of the team is a major problem, the reality is their best center back is better than ours, their best midfielder is better than ours and their best striker is better than ours. We have a better goalkeeper who has made a difference, God knows where we would of been without him.
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They don't have a better centre-half than Balogun.

We don't have another centre-half who's anywhere near as good as Balogun.

But Balogun is made of cardboard.
 
I’d like to see a statement of intent with Clement when it comes to the final. Drop Tavernier,Barisic,Lundstrum,Goldson(likely injured anyway)and any others who are no longer in his plans for us going forward. It’ll also make us a better team, these players ooze capitulation and there’s no reason why they will change for that game.
 
JC85 said:
This squad can't beat Celtic in a meaningful game ffs, when will people learn? It's been 2 fucking years. What do you think is going to change next Saturday?

We need the season over and done with.
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5-4-1 formation, leave no space for them to play. Get a goal from a counter attack or a Tav free kick special before he signs off.
Worth a try, rather than the wide open, meek, powder puff stuff from us in recent encounters.
 
It’s all about opinions but I would prefer us to play our club captain, top goal scorer and most important outfield player in the cup final.
TerryMunro said:
I’d like to see a statement of intent with Clement when it comes to the final. Drop Tavernier,Barisic,Lundstrum,Goldson(likely injured anyway)and any others who are no longer in his plans for us going forward. It’ll also make us a better team, these players ooze capitulation and there’s no reason why they will change for that game.
Click to expand...
 
Ready72 said:
Carter Vickers is a better centre half than Leon Balogun.
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I honestly wouldn't say so, but it's not really relevant, is it?

A fit and regular Leon Balogun isn't a realistic possibility.

Our central-defensive issues have never been all that settled in the 40yrs I've spent watching Rangers.

Yes, there'll be one or two that have slipped my mind, but from a quick think back...

Very decent and reliable regulars, almost uninterrupted spells:

Over 1yr, max 2yrs:
McLelland, Butcher, McLaren, Amoruso, Moore, Andrews

3+yrs:
Gough, Weir, and none other than Lord Bomber of Edmiston Drive himself

Davie Weir was pretty much constant from Jan 2007 to May 2011, and he's the last name I've got.

No wonder we've been leakier than a diseased clunge.
 
Posted this elsewhere but PC has a huge few months coming up.

If he fails to win the SC, that'll be four games versus them and no wins, which in turn, means a lot (more) fans will start to question the appointment given the huge loss of form and results since March.

He's then got CL qualification to secure. Most fans know it's a far from certain given the calibre of opponent but failure here will heap more pressure onto PC, who we expect to have his 'own players' in by this point.

Then he will have a game vs them at the Piggery and another defeat could see that pressure become untenable.

Come Sept and he hasn't won 2 out of these 3 scenarios, 75% of the fans will want him gone imo.
 
Unless something miraculous happens and they have an off day then we aren't winning the cup. It'll hurt for a day or 2 them attention will turn to next season, and said cup loss should have no bearing on it
 
SM™ said:
The vermin were there for the taking this season.

Confidence was near zero. Losing at home to Hearts, dropping points against the likes of Motherwell and Kilmarnock.

Had we escaped serious loss to injury, especially up front, we'd have spent long enough on the front foot to save that rickety defence from coming under anywhere near as much pressure.

Similarly, had our scouting/recruitment been a little better, and the board had pushed the boat out a little more, we'd also likely have had two in the bag by now.

We'd have scored more, and we'd have conceded less.

CL place would've been in the bag, and a treble would've been a very distinct possibility.
Click to expand...
Not getting a striker in January has really cost us big time
 
Ampersand said:
Posted this elsewhere but PC has a huge few months coming up.

If he fails to win the SC, that'll be four games versus them and no wins, which in turn, means a lot (more) fans will start to question the appointment given the huge loss of form and results since March.

He's then got CL qualification to secure. Most fans know it's a far from certain given the calibre of opponent but failure here will heap more pressure onto PC, who we expect to have his 'own players' in by this point.

Then he will have a game vs them at the Piggery and another defeat could see that pressure become untenable.

Come Sept and he hasn't won 2 out of these 3 scenarios, 75% of the fans will want him gone imo.
Click to expand...
Then its groundhog day once again.
 
Monty_greenock34 said:
The players owe us at the very least them two achievements.

I think if we win the cup and qualified from a favourable draw to get the champions league money this season is quickly forgotten about.

First things first though is win the cup and then we hopefully see a clearout.

Im very much the optimist but if we dont win cup or qualify for CL its going to be another long season next season.
Click to expand...
Unfortunately I don't think the players have the belief or the mentality to beat Celtic in the cup final.
 
SM™ said:
I honestly wouldn't say so, but it's not really relevant, is it?

A fit and regular Leon Balogun isn't a realistic possibility.

Our central-defensive issues have never been all that settled in the 40yrs I've spent watching Rangers.

Yes, there'll be one or two that have slipped my mind, but from a quick think back...

Very decent and reliable regulars, almost uninterrupted spells:

Over 1yr, max 2yrs:
McLelland, Butcher, McLaren, Amoruso, Moore, Andrews

3+yrs:
Gough, Weir, and none other than Lord Bomber of Edmiston Drive himself

Davie Weir was pretty much constant from Jan 2007 to May 2011, and he's the last name I've got.

No wonder we've been leakier than a diseased clunge.
Click to expand...
It’s a symptom of where we are. I’m sure I read on here yesterday that since the 60’s, Celtic have won the most trophies in Scotland. That doesn’t surprise me, and I think a lot of people are in for a rude awakening next year sadly with the trophy count.
Rangers as a business needs drastically overhauled and a proper strategy fed in to the way we run the playing squad.

We’re rapidly running out of arguments for being the “biggest” club in Scotland.
 
SC for me as we need to keep our trophy haul above them and hopefully puts down a marker for next season, although it will probably be a very different team we have.

We need silverware.
 
Ready72 said:
It’s a symptom of where we are. I’m sure I read on here yesterday that since the 60’s, Celtic have won the most trophies in Scotland. That doesn’t surprise me, and I think a lot of people are in for a rude awakening next year sadly with the trophy count.
Rangers as a business needs drastically overhauled and a proper strategy fed in to the way we run the playing squad.

We’re rapidly running out of arguments for being the “biggest” club in Scotland.
Click to expand...
It's done.

CFC has a decades long planning process whereas we've been gung-ho all this century.

Lawwell will go down as their greatest ever custodian who cemented them in No1 spot, we need to find a gazzilionaire or hope they find their own Craig Whyte, to be able to get back on terms.

They've got £70m in the bank, probs get £30m for O'Reilly (massively overpriced but they'll get it) and then the £40-£60m for the CL.

They could literally bulldoze their main stand and build a new one and still have £40m in the bank whereas we are spending money we don't have to stay second forever.

It's been a horrendous century for the club.
 
Ampersand said:
It's done.

CFC has a decades long planning process whereas we've been gung-ho all this century.

Lawwell will go down as their greatest ever custodian who cemented them in No1 spot, we need to find a gazzilionaire or hope they find their own Craig Whyte, to be able to get back on terms.

They've got £70m in the bank, probs get £30m for O'Reilly (massively overpriced but they'll get it) and then the £40-£60m for the CL.

They could literally bulldoze their main stand and build a new one and still have £40m in the bank whereas we are spending money we don't have to stay second forever.

It's been a horrendous century for the club.
Click to expand...
Cannot argue with any of that. Sobering
 
Single goal defeats and a draw, like it or not in an angry world of being glass half empty, we have every chance of winning the Cup even with injuries.

Haven't seen a thread but read the following the other day -
Leverkusen to win the Europa bumps Benfica to the CL groups and allows us to be seeded in CL Qualifiers, which would be huge.
We are automatically qualified for the Europa League group even if we lose our first qualifier.
First Qualifier opponents are the likes of Fenerbahce, FC Twente
IF seeded then it's the likes of Prague or Salzburg for CL riches.

All doable, let's win the Cup and let's go into the Summer with some optimism!
We are guaranteed Europa League, 8 games minimum, 4 full houses at Ibrox and chance to be competitive, win more prize money in the League and progress.
In a worst case scenario we should absolutely be looking to invest the EL financial guarantee into backing Clement to make the CL. If we don't, then there's no spending of money of we never had
 
Ampersand said:
It's done.

CFC has a decades long planning process whereas we've been gung-ho all this century.

Lawwell will go down as their greatest ever custodian who cemented them in No1 spot, we need to find a gazzilionaire or hope they find their own Craig Whyte, to be able to get back on terms.

They've got £70m in the bank, probs get £30m for O'Reilly (massively overpriced but they'll get it) and then the £40-£60m for the CL.

They could literally bulldoze their main stand and build a new one and still have £40m in the bank whereas we are spending money we don't have to stay second forever.

It's been a horrendous century for the club.
Click to expand...

2nd half Murray and 2012 have gutted the club.

the fans have gone to the well again and again, we may have experienced espanyolification, but the fans have proven to be secomnd to none.

I think that's where so much frustration comes from, we didnt walk away, we've done all we could and more and yet...
 
club175 said:
I don't think the Scottish cup has any relevance to next season. The reality is that Celtic are a much better team than us currently with their tails up so every chance we take a sore one in the final. Next season there are no excuses. Clement has had 7 months in post and should have everything in place to go into pre season with his own players. I just hope we don't do our usual of waiting until august to get half the new players in.

In terms of champions league, it will be a difficult task to get into it but isn't insurmountable.
Click to expand...
One thing they are not is a much better team
 
Ampersand said:
Posted this elsewhere but PC has a huge few months coming up.

If he fails to win the SC, that'll be four games versus them and no wins, which in turn, means a lot (more) fans will start to question the appointment given the huge loss of form and results since March.

He's then got CL qualification to secure. Most fans know it's a far from certain given the calibre of opponent but failure here will heap more pressure onto PC, who we expect to have his 'own players' in by this point.

Then he will have a game vs them at the Piggery and another defeat could see that pressure become untenable.

Come Sept and he hasn't won 2 out of these 3 scenarios, 75% of the fans will want him gone imo.
Click to expand...
I think it would be more 75% of folk on here rather than the fan base generally.
Instead of grading improvement in results against them, we should be looking for incremental improvement.
We'd need too much money, which we don't have, to create the turnaround you're suggesting is the barometer of success.
I was challenged on here in January/February when I said I'd decide how he was doing after eighteen months. The person who replied said he'd seen enough (implying he was all in on Phil). Wonder what he thinks now.
Folks on here need to look at the bigger picture.
 
Davester said:
We don`t win the SC I`m afraid. CL next season is doable. First OF next season takes on importance like no other for years probably. We take a scudding in that, and all bets are off.
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If we lose in the cup final and get beat in the 1st old firm game next season that will be 5 old firm defeats in a row for PC
 
Scottish Cup in the grand scheme of things doesn't matter a jot this season - the only reason its of any relevance is because we are playing them in the final.

even if we win a double most fans (correctly) will consider the season a failure.

as for qualifying for the CL - the fair chunk of our current squad will not be here for that next season - to name a few

McLaughlin
Butland (likely)
Jack
Roofe
Borna
Lundstram
Lammers (likely)
Balogun
Hagi (likely)

thats not to mention if Tav / Goldson / Dessers / go.
 
Myogi said:
I think the spine of the team is a major problem, the reality is their best center back is better than ours, their best midfielder is better than ours and their best striker is better than ours. We have a better goalkeeper who has made a difference, God knows where we would have been without him.
Click to expand...
And that really is the reality unfortunately :(
 
Monty_greenock34 said:
The players owe us at the very least them two achievements.

I think if we win the cup and qualified from a favourable draw to get the champions league money this season is quickly forgotten about.

First things first though is win the cup and then we hopefully see a clearout.

Im very much the optimist but if we dont win cup or qualify for CL its going to be another long season next season.
Click to expand...
Hopefully most of players that are in squad for SC wont be anywhere near CL
 
Monty_greenock34 said:
The players owe us at the very least them two achievements.

I think if we win the cup and qualified from a favourable draw to get the champions league money this season is quickly forgotten about.

First things first though is win the cup and then we hopefully see a clearout.

Im very much the optimist but if we dont win cup or qualify for CL its going to be another long season next season.
Click to expand...
"...this season is quickly forgotten about."

I know what you mean but I won't be forgetting about it.
 
club175 said:
I don't think the Scottish cup has any relevance to next season. The reality is that Celtic are a much better team than us currently with their tails up so every chance we take a sore one in the final. Next season there are no excuses. Clement has had 7 months in post and should have everything in place to go into pre season with his own players. I just hope we don't do our usual of waiting until august to get half the new players in.

In terms of champions league, it will be a difficult task to get into it but isn't insurmountable.
Click to expand...
Win the Scottish Cup and the honours won is 119-117 in our favour. Lose it and it's 118-118.
 
I don't see any way we win the cup and honestly, as it stands, I'm not even bothered about it anymore.

I hope to Christ work is being done right now for the summer to hopefully have some chance at qualifying for the CL.
 
The Scottish Cup is a must win. I think the support is angrier than what even the club and definitely the players may realise currently. I know I’ve surprised myself the last week or so.

Going into next year with Parkhead as the first OF game without a victory in the final is setting Clement up for a rough start to next season. I don’t think Rangers fans can tolerate not winning these games consistently and this squad have been a complete embarrassment in the games for a number of years now.
 
It's more likely than not that we'll lose next Saturday, but not all doom and gloom.
However, one positive from the recent 3-3 game at Ibrox is that in 45 mins, we put the ball in their net 4 times, albeit Dessers was disallowed. Other than McGregor, they were at full strength. Hopefully, we'll have some semblance of a back 4, plus Sterling, Sima and/or Matondo available. My fingers are still crossed that we can produce a performance.
 
Ampersand said:
Posted this elsewhere but PC has a huge few months coming up.

If he fails to win the SC, that'll be four games versus them and no wins, which in turn, means a lot (more) fans will start to question the appointment given the huge loss of form and results since March.

He's then got CL qualification to secure. Most fans know it's a far from certain given the calibre of opponent but failure here will heap more pressure onto PC, who we expect to have his 'own players' in by this point.

Then he will have a game vs them at the Piggery and another defeat could see that pressure become untenable.

Come Sept and he hasn't won 2 out of these 3 scenarios, 75% of the fans will want him gone imo.
Click to expand...
We could equally reverse all your scenarios
 
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