Honeymoon Is Over For The Manger Next Season

Someone may have already said this but for me we need to try and analyse honestly what went wrong in both winter breaks...thats 2 seasons that by the end of the year we are thinking "this could be it" (more so this season) but then the winter break comes and it all falls apart.
 
Drumchapel-Bear said:
What are these other things?

The fact Gerrard is under serious pressure from a lot of our fans, proves a large chunk of our fans only judge our managers on whether they are above Celtic or not. Gerrard has improved us by every possible measure since he took the job on, outwith finishing above Celtic in the league. So if he's under pressure (which he is), then it must be because he's not winning a title against a rival with double the spend of him and a rival who had far greater foundations already in place than him when he inherited his job.

That's looking at it objectively. That's the way people down South will look at it.

If Gerrard was to leave Rangers this summer he would at a bare minimum walk into a top Championship job, possibly even lower end of the EPL with a West Ham or the likes. Because most people looking from the outside in, will see he's actually done a good job here.
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You are right.
Gerrard's stock is extremely high in England.
I know it must amaze some on here, but getting a result in Europe somehow impresses people in England far more than beating Hamilton.
That is what they notice far more.
I don't know why they are like this, but there you are.
 
southsideger68 said:
Someone may have already said this but for me we need to try and analyse honestly what went wrong in both winter breaks...thats 2 seasons that by the end of the year we are thinking "this could be it" (more so this season) but then the winter break comes and it all falls apart.
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It may not be the same things.
Has anyone considered that?
 
Hopefully we are just a few players with the right winning mentality away from getting trophies back. I agree Gerrard needs success this coming season
 
We need to start battering teams, nice football is good if your winning but sometimes wins need to be ground out which means scoring goals and not conceding. Walter knew how to win games even when the team was toiling, that's what we need. The league is the priority this season.
 
Drumchapel-Bear said:
What are these other things?

The fact Gerrard is under serious pressure from a lot of our fans, proves a large chunk of our fans only judge our managers on whether they are above Celtic or not. Gerrard has improved us by every possible measure since he took the job on, outwith finishing above Celtic in the league. So if he's under pressure (which he is), then it must be because he's not winning a title against a rival with double the spend of him and a rival who had far greater foundations already in place than him when he inherited his job.

That's looking at it objectively. That's the way people down South will look at it.

If Gerrard was to leave Rangers this summer he would at a bare minimum walk into a top Championship job, possibly even lower end of the EPL with a West Ham or the likes. Because most people looking from the outside in, will see he's actually done a good job here.
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Mount a serious league campaign that doesn't capitulate after Christmas and consistently beat the smaller teams in the league and cups.

Gerrard was under serious pressure because of his inability to manage a team to victory over a team that's just been relegated and a team that have been unfathomably survived in the SPFL for years now, not because he wasn't finishing ahead of Celtic.

Like most fans I would be satisfied if there were signs of improvement in that front but this season has turned into a mirror image of last year's, if we're all being honest.

I don't think anyone takes the Scottish league seriously enough to conclude that a guy that can't win trophies against one serious rival is doing a good enough job. He'd get a job down south based as much on his name as he would on his success up here. Managers don't tend to go onto bigger and better things from Scotland.
 
My worry is that the opposition we have on a weekly bases is dire,and we have lost points to just about everybody,equally a competition with only the filth to beat is just as bad,I am all for SG but there can not be many of us not disappointed at our progress domestically.
 
ClockworkOrange said:
Mount a serious league campaign that doesn't capitulate after Christmas and consistently beat the smaller teams in the league and cups.

Gerrard was under serious pressure because of his inability to manage a team to victory over a team that's just been relegated and a team that have been unfathomably survived in the SPFL for years now, not because he wasn't finishing ahead of Celtic.

Like most fans I would be satisfied if there were signs of improvement in that front but this season has turned into a mirror image of last year's, if we're all being honest.

I don't think anyone takes the Scottish league seriously enough to conclude that a guy that can't win trophies against one serious rival is doing a good enough job. He'd get a job down south based as much on his name as he would on his success up here. Managers don't tend to go onto bigger and better things from Scotland.
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You can easily pick out individual games or performances to suit your narrative.

He had us miles in front of 3rd place but a bit behind Celtic. Which if you're simply looking at the numbers, is just about where we should be.

The ''collapse'' after December, was frustrating as f*ck. Horrendous.

What you don't see the dissenters saying though is that we were still on track to amass a points total that would have won us the title in many seasons in the past. The first half of the season, we had amassed our best points total from half a season in so many years.

You don't see people admitting Celtic's ruthlessness is as much of a problem as our own issues in dropping points.

We probably should have won a cup by now, and it would have given us all a good day out but in the wider scheme of things, it's not important. The cup is only really important when it's part of the treble. We could finish 4th and win the League Cup but it would still be seen as a shocking season. And if we are being honest, if that League Cup Final is played out in the same way another 99 times we are winning it 99 times. Your main striker isn't missing that many sitters in as dominating a performance as that ever again. It's one of the most incredible matches you'll ever see a team losing.
 
Craig McColl said:
I've had discussions on here before about Gerrard and what an easy ride many have given him domestically .(European football he's been a success)
People can argue black is white all they want but he wins the league next season or he's asked to leave be that mutual or falling on his own sword.Nothing to do with them going for a meaningless 10 IAR but a Rangers manager can't get anymore than 3 tries at it.In fact he's the 1st I can think of in modern times that has been given this much leeway and time to get it right.
It's now time to deliver or we move on to someone else imo.
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Rubbish...
 
Our last 5 domestic games were

1-0 win against Livi at home
2-2 draw at St Johnstone
1-0 loss to Hearts at Tynecastle and out of the Cup
1-0 loss to Hamilton at Ibrox
1-0 win at Ross County

The league was called at a point when our form was shocking. Had the season continued the managers reputation would have seriously suffered and we might have found ourselves in the market for someone else.

As it stands, we're all behind him for next season, but there's not much in our recent form to suggest he knows what went wrong or how to fix it.
 
Drumchapel-Bear said:
You can easily pick out individual games or performances to suit your narrative.

He had us miles in front of 3rd place but a bit behind Celtic. Which if you're simply looking at the numbers, is just about where we should be.

The ''collapse'' after December, was frustrating as f*ck. Horrendous.

What you don't see the dissenters saying though is that we were still on track to amass a points total that would have won us the title in many seasons in the past. The first half of the season, we had amassed our best points total from half a season in so many years.

You don't see people admitting Celtic's ruthlessness is as much of a problem as our own issues in dropping points.

We probably should have won a cup by now, and it would have given us all a good day out but in the wider scheme of things, it's not important. The cup is only really important when it's part of the treble. We could finish 4th and win the League Cup but it would still be seen as a shocking season. And if we are being honest, if that League Cup Final is played out in the same way another 99 times we are winning it 99 times. You're main striker isn't missing that many sitters in as dominating a performance as that ever again. It's one of the most incredible matches you'll ever see a team losing.
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I'm not picking out individual games or performances for a narrative - you said he's under serious pressure because of his inability to beat Celtic when that's clearly not the case: it's because of a catastrophic post-Christmas run which includes dropped points against teams so pish I have PTSD just thinking about it.

And while I'll acknowledge - and haven't ever not acknowledged, if that makes sense - that second in the league is probably where we should be, a good first half of the season and a projected points tally that's higher than previous seasons only goes so far in the defence of Gerrard (and probably doesn't count much for those interested English teams, by the way). In fact, from our last six or seven games, you could suggest the gap was going to get bigger.

Ultimately I think I'll made that distinction again: progress has been made, but I'm not sure it's big enough.
 
Craig McColl said:
I've had discussions on here before about Gerrard and what an easy ride many have given him domestically .(European football he's been a success)
People can argue black is white all they want but he wins the league next season or he's asked to leave be that mutual or falling on his own sword.Nothing to do with them going for a meaningless 10 IAR but a Rangers manager can't get anymore than 3 tries at it.In fact he's the 1st I can think of in modern times that has been given this much leeway and time to get it right.
It's now time to deliver or we move on to someone else imo.
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We won’t win the league , Scottish football is CORRUPT .
 
TN8 said:
Wrong.

If we don't make progress he goes. You can't sack a manager for not winning a league title in our situation.
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If they were to win it, for me we must be single digits behind and at least one of the cups and group stage Europa. At a bare minimum
 
ClockworkOrange said:
I'm not picking out individual games or performances for a narrative - you said he's under serious pressure because of his inability to beat Celtic when that's clearly not the case: it's because of a catastrophic post-Christmas run which includes dropped points against teams so pish I have PTSD just thinking about it.

And while I'll acknowledge - and haven't ever not acknowledged, if that makes sense - that second in the league is probably where we should be, a good first half of the season and a projected points tally that's higher than previous seasons only goes so far in the defence of Gerrard (and probably doesn't count much for those interested English teams, by the way). In fact, from our last six or seven games, you could suggest the gap was going to get bigger.

Ultimately I think I'll made that distinction again: progress has been made, but I'm not sure it's big enough.
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It hasn't been two seasons yet and we've gone from routine humiliation against Celtic and not getting past the preliminary round of qualifying for Europe to being better head to head and the last 32.

Jurgen Klopp is arguably the best manager in the world and it took him 5 years to sort Liverpool out.

There is no quick fix for a club in our position and it's really alarming that the fans don't understand this
 
Necro said:
It hasn't been two seasons yet and we've gone from routine humiliation against Celtic and not getting past the preliminary round of qualifying for Europe to being better head to head and the last 32.

Jurgen Klopp is arguably the best manager in the world and it took him 5 years to sort Liverpool out.

There is no quick fix for a club in our position and it's really alarming that the fans don't understand this
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Post three in this thread literally responds to these ideas.
 
Necro said:
It hasn't been two seasons yet and we've gone from routine humiliation against Celtic and not getting past the preliminary round of qualifying for Europe to being better head to head and the last 32.

Jurgen Klopp is arguably the best manager in the world and it took him 5 years to sort Liverpool out.

There is no quick fix for a club in our position and it's really alarming that the fans don't understand this
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If Klopp had a run of form like we did in February he wouldn't be there now.
 
bluestreak said:
Nope,he’ll go when he’s ready, and that won’t be next year
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If we are trophyless next season SG is finished - he might not want to go but I firmly believe the fans will believe 3 seasons with no success just isn't good enough.

I have backed SG tirelessly on here, 100% believed he was the man to take us back where we belong but our collapse since January has made me question my own belief in SG, he is not above criticism.
 
ClockworkOrange said:
I'm not picking out individual games or performances for a narrative - you said he's under serious pressure because of his inability to beat Celtic when that's clearly not the case: it's because of a catastrophic post-Christmas run which includes dropped points against teams so pish I have PTSD just thinking about it.

And while I'll acknowledge - and haven't ever not acknowledged, if that makes sense - that second in the league is probably where we should be, a good first half of the season and a projected points tally that's higher than previous seasons only goes so far in the defence of Gerrard (and probably doesn't count much for those interested English teams, by the way). In fact, from our last six or seven games, you could suggest the gap was going to get bigger.

Ultimately I think I'll made that distinction again: progress has been made, but I'm not sure it's big enough.
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We've dropped points to sh*te teams every season in my lifetime though. Even when we were doing 9IAR, sweeping all before us under Advocaat at first or under Walter in his 2nd stint. Dropping points to sh*te teams is the norm over the course of a season.

What isn't the norm, is some of Celtic's points averages in the last few seasons. We need them to drop down a level again and then we will be right there waiting for them, ready to pounce. If they continue to hit 90-100 points then we are in serious trouble unless we get a huge injection of cash from somewhere that allows us to build some serious squad depth.

Our post December slump coincided with injuries to Helander, Tav, Barisic and Defoe. Morelos also getting a 4 game ban and coming back from that unfit had a big impact. We simply don't have the same level of player to bring in when we lose guys like this.

They can bring guys like Rogic and Ntcham in out of the cold to cover for them. That's the difference.
 
ClockworkOrange said:
Post three in this thread literally responds to these ideas.
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It doesn't though, it's not a matter of comparing Gerrard to Pedro/Warburton, it's a matter of what he's managed to achieve already from a position of immense weakness.

"Compare Gerrard to Gerrard" ok, he made clear progress in Europe in a harder group and for the majority of the domestic season we looked significantly better too.

You can hold the collapse against him if you want and it will have merit but at the same time even with the poor form, it's not the managers fault that players made individual errors resulting in goals most weeks.
 
barrheadbear said:
If we are trophyless next season SG is finished - he might not want to go but I firmly believe the fans will believe 3 seasons with no success just isn't good enough.

I have backed SG tirelessly on here, 100% believed he was the man to take us back where we belong but our collapse since January has made me question my own belief in SG, he is not above criticism.
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No he’s not,but he’s above sacking before 5 seasons
 
Drumchapel-Bear said:
We've dropped points to sh*te teams every season in my lifetime though. Even when we were doing 9IAR, sweeping all before us under Advocaat at first or under Walter in his 2nd stint. Dropping points to sh*te teams is the norm over the course of a season.

What isn't the norm, is some of Celtic's points averages in the last few seasons. We need them to drop down a level again and then we will be right there waiting for them, ready to pounce. If they continue to hit 90-100 points then we are in serious trouble unless we get a huge injection of cash from somewhere that allows us to build some serious squad depth.

Our post December slump coincided with injuries to Helander, Tav, Barisic and Defoe. Morelos also getting a 4 game ban and coming back from that unfit had a big impact. We simply don't have the same level of player to bring in when we lose guys like this.

They can bring guys like Rogic and Ntcham in out of the cold to cover for them. That's the difference.
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Smith and Advocaat's teams were good enough to subsume those losses. They were also much rarer and sporadic than the run of form that we had post-Christmas. Can't really argue with anything else in the post.
 
I am 100% behind Gerrard but I am sure if he does not stop 10IAR then he will be the first to admit defeat and walk. I have said it a manager no matter the team really needs 3 Seasons before he can be truly judged. I do think he is making progress and IMHO the 2 mistakes he has made and should learn from is 1. after October he was reluctant to rotate the squad & made 1 maybe 2 changes even between Europe and domestic games; and 2. because of 1. the other teams found a way to defend and sometimes defeat the same old same old tactics. This is the reason after the break our results crumbled some of the players took their positions for granted and when changes were made the incoming players were not sharp due to lack of game time.
 
Necro said:
It doesn't though, it's not a matter of comparing Gerrard to Pedro/Warburton, it's a matter of what he's managed to achieve already from a position of immense weakness.

"Compare Gerrard to Gerrard" ok, he made clear progress in Europe in a harder group and for the majority of the domestic season we looked significantly better too.

You can hold the collapse against him if you want and it will have merit but at the same time even with the poor form, it's not the managers fault that players made individual errors resulting in goals most weeks.
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Gerrard has improved the club from the Pedro/Warburton shambles but now you're two years into the post his progress has to be defined from within. Progress in Europe was great but unless this forum has suddenly turned into a group of fans with the same mindset as those who support Aberdeen or Hibs, he deserves no credit for half a good season. It's Rangers he manages.

Individual errors have been costly but the team looked shot to bits after that Hamilton game and the performance against Hearts was bordered on mutinous.
 
Drumchapel-Bear said:
We've dropped points to sh*te teams every season in my lifetime though. Even when we were doing 9IAR, sweeping all before us under Advocaat at first or under Walter in his 2nd stint. Dropping points to sh*te teams is the norm over the course of a season.

What isn't the norm, is some of Celtic's points averages in the last few seasons. We need them to drop down a level again and then we will be right there waiting for them, ready to pounce. If they continue to hit 90-100 points then we are in serious trouble unless we get a huge injection of cash from somewhere that allows us to build some serious squad depth.

Our post December slump coincided with injuries to Helander, Tav, Barisic and Defoe. Morelos also getting a 4 game ban and coming back from that unfit had a big impact. We simply don't have the same level of player to bring in when we lose guys like this.

They can bring guys like Rogic and Ntcham in out of the cold to cover for them. That's the difference.
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Our domestic form is horrendous mate.

Over 2 seasons now on average we drop points every 3 games.. that's ridiculously bad.

And the reason celtic are sweeping teams aside is because the standard of the league is as poor as it's ever been.. which only highlights our own domestic failings.

For me it's not only our form, its decisions Gerrard makes during games that are blatantly wrong.

I gave up on him at Rugby Park in Febuary.

I stood and watched a Rangers manager freeze under pressure that night.

He genunly had no idea how to regain control of that game and didnt react as Kilmarnock started to push forward and dominate.

He stood with his arms folded staring at what the rest of us were watching and didnt react to what was happening on the pitch.. we'd have been just as good with a mannequin in the dug out.

Anyway the inevitable happened and Gerrard makes his first sub around 80 minutes after we go from 1-0 up to 2-1 down.

Hes far too reactive tactically.. I want a manager who's going to spot a problem early on and sort it there and then.

I genuinly hope I'm wrong but I only see this going one way under Gerrard.
 
We can’t play like we did post-January imo. The pressure next season will be immense. I believe in him; hopefully he can can learn from his mistakes and deliver.
 
Why do we have a thread for next season starting with a negative. You could quite easily start one with him winning it.

Or we could just wait until we are actually seeing football played again, with a squad available to him.
 
SOB-WATP said:
Our domestic form is horrendous mate.

Over 2 seasons now on average we drop points every 3 games.. that's ridiculously bad.

And the reason celtic are sweeping teams aside is because the standard of the league is as poor as it's ever been.. which only highlights our own domestic failings.

For me it's not only our form, its decisions Gerrard makes during games that are blatantly wrong.

I gave up on him at Rugby Park in Febuary.

I stood and watched a Rangers manager freeze under pressure that night.

He genunly had no idea how to regain control of that game and didnt react as Kilmarnock started to push forward and dominate.

He stood with his arms folded staring at what the rest of us were watching and didnt react to what was happening on the pitch.. we'd have been just as good with a mannequin in the dug out.

Anyway the inevitable happened and Gerrard makes his first sub around 80 minutes after we go from 1-0 up to 2-1 down.

Hes far too reactive tactically.. I want a manager who's going to spot a problem early on and sort it there and then.

I genuinly hope I'm wrong but I only see this going one way under Gerrard.
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Unfortunately,You’re not wrong.
 
bluestreak said:
Oh I would give me odds.Its not just a Manager we would replace Bro, look at his back room team, the changes at Ibrox and the training centre, he’ll know when it’s time to go.
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I wasn’t one of those suggesting he should go after the collapse in January and February and argued that it was ridiculous to imagine either he or the club would seriously entertain it, but next season will be his third and he needs to demonstrate that he’s able to rectify the problems that saw our season implode in the new year and ensure we’re firstly back competing evenly with the Yahoos and perhaps more significantly able to go one better in the cups.

If he gets off to a bad start and none of that appears on the cards the calls for his head will quickly turn into a roar. We’ve seen it happen enough times before that none of us should really be surprised if it does again, and simply having the name Steven Gerrard may not be enough to save him anymore.
 
bearspakora said:
I don't think the OP really realises what Stevie is up against. The never ending media campaign to have our best striker banned, for a start. Even Klopp in the Ibrox dugout would face the same ref corruption.
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I totally agree,
Have some already forgotten about the expose of the SPFL only 2 weeks ago?
If ever we needed proof positive that the Cabal are anti Rangers...we now have it.
Just keep our powder dry off the Park & beat the Teams on it.
 
Agree with most of the points above imo. We seem solid enough at the back (the odd mistake aside) and we have two good strikers in Alfie and Defoe. The problem in my opinion would be our lack of goals in midfield. For the price tag, Kent gives 7 goals a season. Compare and contrast to the scum who had goals all over midfield and even with Jullien at the back. For me that’s the difference
 
Kylegib said:
Everyone has a part to play next season and we need to be fully behind them without all the negativity.
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Are you kidding? There are guys on here (and no doubt on this very thread but they're all on ignore) who are frothing at the gash in anticipation for the next dropped point so they can smugly proclaim they were right along. They can't wait. You need to remember that a lot of people on the forum don't support Rangers the way most of us do. They get their kicks out of firing the boot in to our players/manager online. If you don't believe me just wait to you see the glee from them when it happens. Utter weirdos.
 
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