A clear example from the Scotland v NornIron game on why the Arthur Boruc defence is flawed in the Scottish context

There was a ‘Spurs fan’ (sadly, joined by his young son) making similar gestures throughout their most recent pre-season friendly at Ibrox.

Other Spurs fans were looking at them slightly bewildered. Unfortunately, a few bears gave them the reaction they were looking for (not that I place blame on them, would just have been better ignored or reported).
 
At the time of the Arthur Boruc carry-on, the RC Church was at pains to say that absolutely no-one would ever make the sign of the cross to provoke or incite.


The Roman Catholic Church has criticised prosecutors for cautioning a Celtic goalkeeper who crossed himself during a match against Rangers.

Artur Boruc was cautioned for a breach of the peace over the incident at an Old Firm match at Ibrox in February.

The church called it "worrying and alarming" as the sign of the cross was a "gesture of religious reverence".

However, the Crown Office said the decision was based on the player's behaviour, rather than a single act.


Was the chap in the video was making a "gesture of religious reverence"?
 
Probably the closest this person has ever gotten to actually practising the religion they apparently follow so devoutly. Its always a good laugh hearing about glasgows "strong" catholic community that genuinely only exists on a surface level and that is it. It'd be interesting to see how many claim to be catholic but have absolutely no idea or intention of actually participating in the religion itself.
 
mdingwall said:
This cretin was obviously out to provoke - with the aid of a steward, no-man’s land and a fence.

He is not acting in an act of faith, praise or supplication. He is in fact inspired by sectarian hatred as he believes making the sign of the cross is a Catholic thing to do and will offend and provoke Protestants.

Hatred, pure and simple.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1772951798996697136
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Hopefully he can be identified. Named and shamed and his employer sees it. Would be interesting to see if they would find his hatred of Protestants acceptable?
 
mdingwall said:
This cretin was obviously out to provoke - with the aid of a steward, no-man’s land and a fence.

He is not acting in an act of faith, praise or supplication. He is in fact inspired by sectarian hatred as he believes making the sign of the cross is a Catholic thing to do and will offend and provoke Protestants.

Hatred, pure and simple.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1772951798996697136
Click to expand...
wtf was that? :))

What a fanny
 
Luther saw no wrong with Protestants doing this. This invocation isn't exclusive to Papists.

The Sign of the Cross in the Reformation​

At the time of the Reformation, things were no different. Conservative reformers such as the Church of England’s Archbishop Thomas Cranmer and, in Germany, Martin Luther did not abolish signing the cross. Still, they endeavored to appropriate its use to significant occasions such as Holy Baptism, Holy Communion, affirming the Creed, and the benediction at the end of Mass. Luther was especially concerned about retaining this meaningful act of worship, preserving nearly all of its liturgical and devotional uses. In the realm of catechesis, Luther took his lead from St. Cyril, Bishop of Jerusalem (AD 315 – 386), who, in his ancient catechism for children, remarked:

Let us not then be ashamed to confess the Crucified. Be the Cross our seal made with boldness by our fingers on our brow and in everything; over the bread we eat, and the cup we drink; in our comings in, and goings out; before our sleep, when we lie down and when we awake… It is the Sign of the faithful and the dread of evils; for He has triumphed over them in it, having made a show of them openly; for when they see the Cross, they are reminded of the Crucified; they are afraid of Him, Who hath bruised the heads of the dragon. Despise not the seal of baptism, because of the freeness of the Gift; but for this rather honor thy Benefactor. [5]

Luther thought no different. He purposed to see to it that all children of the Reformation were liberated to worship the Lord in this most meaningful and dignified expression of faith and devotion. Consequently, he encouraged the signing of the cross with the invocation in his directions for morning and evening prayer within the Small Catechism. There Luther writes:

"In the morning, when you get up, make the sign of the holy cross and say, ‘In the Name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. Amen.’ … In the evening when you go to bed, make the sign of the holy cross and say…." [6]
 
PhilippeTheFair said:
Luther saw no wrong with Protestants doing this. This invocation isn't exclusive to Papists.

The Sign of the Cross in the Reformation​

At the time of the Reformation, things were no different. Conservative reformers such as the Church of England’s Archbishop Thomas Cranmer and, in Germany, Martin Luther did not abolish signing the cross. Still, they endeavored to appropriate its use to significant occasions such as Holy Baptism, Holy Communion, affirming the Creed, and the benediction at the end of Mass. Luther was especially concerned about retaining this meaningful act of worship, preserving nearly all of its liturgical and devotional uses. In the realm of catechesis, Luther took his lead from St. Cyril, Bishop of Jerusalem (AD 315 – 386), who, in his ancient catechism for children, remarked:

Let us not then be ashamed to confess the Crucified. Be the Cross our seal made with boldness by our fingers on our brow and in everything; over the bread we eat, and the cup we drink; in our comings in, and goings out; before our sleep, when we lie down and when we awake… It is the Sign of the faithful and the dread of evils; for He has triumphed over them in it, having made a show of them openly; for when they see the Cross, they are reminded of the Crucified; they are afraid of Him, Who hath bruised the heads of the dragon. Despise not the seal of baptism, because of the freeness of the Gift; but for this rather honor thy Benefactor. [5]

Luther thought no different. He purposed to see to it that all children of the Reformation were liberated to worship the Lord in this most meaningful and dignified expression of faith and devotion. Consequently, he encouraged the signing of the cross with the invocation in his directions for morning and evening prayer within the Small Catechism. There Luther writes:

"In the morning, when you get up, make the sign of the holy cross and say, ‘In the Name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. Amen.’ … In the evening when you go to bed, make the sign of the holy cross and say…." [6]
Click to expand...

Strange place to worship the lord.

Look Mark is clearly right here. And is this day and age, when just about everybody is getting upset about anything, it only takes one person to be offended in the context of the event. It’s clearly meant to be inflammatory.
 
Portrushbear said:
Did that Muppet get chucked out of the game for that?

If so the game is truly broken
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Obviously not there but I’d hazard a guess there were verbals going on too. He’s clearly looking for a reaction and someone from the other side of the fence reacting to him could potentially end up with a record because of it.

It’s 2024, welcome to the new world.
 
Texas ranger said:
Strange place to worship the lord.

Look Mark is clearly right here. And is this day and age, when just about everybody is getting upset about anything, it only takes one person to be offended in the context of the event. It’s clearly meant to be inflammatory.
Click to expand...

Did I say he was wrong?

It's an ignorant clown doing it looking for a reaction of that there's no doubt.

He didn't get one.

Point I'm making is, it's no just Kaffliks who can do it or have an exclusivity with it.

Jocko or O'Jock has no idea.
 
mdingwall said:
This cretin was obviously out to provoke - with the aid of a steward, no-man’s land and a fence.

He is not acting in an act of faith, praise or supplication. He is in fact inspired by sectarian hatred as he believes making the sign of the cross is a Catholic thing to do and will offend and provoke Protestants.

Hatred, pure and simple.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1772951798996697136
Click to expand...
That’s just someone planting his own bigotry on to other people - damaging that they are outraged by something that HE thinks they should be.

In my Rangers supporting life I have encountered this countless times… people telling me that I must be outraged because Rangers have signed a Catholic is a favourite.
Jon Daly signing certainly had people up in arms about how offended I should be.

And the fucking hate it when you turn it back on them.
 
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Strange. Guy unveils a saltire, nobody reacts. Steward walks down and asks him to leave. Guy starts making some pseudo sign of the cross. Nobody reacts.
Guy leaves.

Tried for a reaction, failed, and the Leigh-Griffiths looking twat snakes off to a slophouse to regale the regulars with his "behind-enemy-lines'tale of bravery.
 
deedle said:
At the time of the Arthur Boruc carry-on, the RC Church was at pains to say that absolutely no-one would ever make the sign of the cross to provoke or incite.


The Roman Catholic Church has criticised prosecutors for cautioning a Celtic goalkeeper who crossed himself during a match against Rangers.

Artur Boruc was cautioned for a breach of the peace over the incident at an Old Firm match at Ibrox in February.

The church called it "worrying and alarming" as the sign of the cross was a "gesture of religious reverence".

However, the Crown Office said the decision was based on the player's behaviour, rather than a single act.


Was the chap in the video was making a "gesture of religious reverence"?
Click to expand...
Surely an act of religious reverence is not something that's done in an attempt to rile people? More "worrying and alarming" is the RC church's refusal to differentiate between genuine religious reverence and someone being an arsehole.
 
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