Frankfurt Morelos

bluetonic said:
Just being realistic , we will see what happens
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What are you basing your realism on?

What about current transfer valuations are realistic. If Aberdeen can drag their heels over a clogger like McKenna slap a £10 million tag on him. And the mentally challengeds can hold Arsenal to ransom over a player who barely kicked a ball last season for a fee north of £20 million.

Then why should we continue to sell ourselves short?

The transfer market is bonkers. We need to be a bit more intelligent when selling our assets.
 
baselbear said:
Did you notice how much better we played in the away match when Defoe went off and Alfredo came on?
Perhaps because the Gibraltarians tired from their first half efforts in both.
It really is a very shit analysis.

I could point out that Defoe did not score in the away match against the 4th best team in Gibraltar and Alfredo scored twice as many as he did overall in only a few minutes more playing time.
That is not a criticism of Defoe by the way. Just adding weight to the counter argument to your nonsense.
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Is it nonsense? I don’t deny what you’re saying, fair point.

But do you deny that we played better football with Alfie out of the team last season? And do you deny his obvious discipline problems? If you do, then the nonsense label is heading your way chief.

I like Alfie as a player. I don’t like him blindly though. Neither will Gerrard, you should get yourself prepared for that mate
 
For me, keeping him unless we get a very big fee that will be reinvested into the team isn't that much of a gamble.

He's virtually guaranteed goals in this league and is still improving month by month. He seems happy, and I think he was genuine in his apology for his disciplinary issues after the Celtic match. Yes, he'll pick up bookings, but a lot of his red cards last season were avoidable and I don't think he'll get involved in the same situations. If he does get suspended through accumulating yellow cards, we're not playing matches with 10 men and we have a more than able replacement in Defoe.
 
ronadamus_prime said:
What are you basing your realism on?

What about current transfer valuations are realistic. If Aberdeen can drag their heels over a clogger like McKenna slap a £10 million tag on him. And the mentally challengeds can hold Arsenal to ransom over a player who barely kicked a ball last season for a fee north of £20 million.

Then why should we continue to sell ourselves short?

The transfer market is bonkers. We need to be a bit more intelligent when selling our assets.
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It is , and maybe I'm not setting our expectations that high but I'm basing it purely on the league we play in and on his form last season goals and red cards, the mentally challengeds player you mention has won nine trophies in the last three years and has played in the CL consistently over that period so has played to a higher standard( wether we like it or not) hence his over inflated fee.
I like Alfie as much as the rest of us and will be astonished if we get £18M+ for him, plus I hope he says anyway for 55;)
 
ronadamus_prime said:
What are you basing your realism on?

What about current transfer valuations are realistic. If Aberdeen can drag their heels over a clogger like McKenna slap a £10 million tag on him. And the mentally challengeds can hold Arsenal to ransom over a player who barely kicked a ball last season for a fee north of £20 million.

Then why should we continue to sell ourselves short?

The transfer market is bonkers. We need to be a bit more intelligent when selling our assets.
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The potential Tierney deal threatens to rip up reality in terms of what we thought the upper ceiling for Scottish based players was.

If he genuinely receives £20m+ bids for his services we’re moving into new territory in terms of what SPFL players can fetch.

I’m not doubting that he’s an excellent prospect who could go on to bigger and better things in the EPL, but blue tinted specs aside, nobody is going to convince me he’s worth more than the country’s top goalscorer.
 
omegaman said:
The potential Tierney deal threatens to rip up reality in terms of what we thought the upper ceiling for Scottish based players was.

If he genuinely receives £20m+ bids for his services we’re moving into new territory in terms of what SPFL players can fetch.

I’m not doubting that he’s an excellent prospect who could go on to bigger and better things in the EPL, but blue tinted specs aside, nobody is going to convince me he’s worth more than the country’s top goalscorer.
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I'm afraid it's back to the cliché. They, or any other player in the World, is worth exactly what someone is willing to pay to get them. And that to a very large extent depends on what type of player the buying club is looking for at that time.
 
bluetonic said:
It is , and maybe I'm not setting our expectations that high but I'm basing it purely on the league we play in and on his form last season goals and red cards, the mentally challengeds player you mention has won nine trophies in the last three years and has played in the CL consistently over that period so has played to a higher standard( wether we like it or not) hence his over inflated fee.
I like Alfie as much as the rest of us and will be astonished if we get £18M+ for him, plus I hope he says anyway for 55;)
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1) why does winning a trophy matter to a players valuation? Many examples of players who havent won things going for big money.
2) no Celtic player has played consistently on the champions league because they dont qualify consistently and when they do they get cuffed.
 
Greebo said:
I'm afraid it's back to the cliché. They, or any other player in the World, is worth exactly what someone is willing to pay to get them. And that to a very large extent depends on what type of player the buying club is looking for at that time.
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Hit the nail on the head.
 
TheFridge said:
1) why does winning a trophy matter to a players valuation? Many examples of players who havent won things going for big money.
2) no Celtic player has played consistently on the champions league because they dont qualify consistently and when they do they get cuffed.
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It’s a crazy argument isn’t it. If only players who won things moved for big fees there would be very few big transfers every season. Fact is, most players go through their careers without winning a sausage.

Furthermore, this higher level they’ve supposedly played at consists of a maximum 6 games every other season.
 
Valley Bluenose said:
It’s a crazy argument isn’t it. If only players who won things moved for big fees there would be very few big transfers every season. Fact is, most players go through their careers without winning a sausage.

Furthermore, this higher level they’ve supposedly played at consists of a maximum 6 games every other season.
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Players playing in Scotland are guaged on Champions League performances and International etc when it comes to bigger fees being spent. Performances in Scotland only take you so far.

We know how good Alfie is but clubs outside of us need more to splash huge cash.
 
If we sell morelos we should put a bid in for martyn waghorn. He knows how we play and where the back of the net is!
 
For once we are in a position of strength. We don't have to sell unless our valuation is met and if it isn't we get to keep a very good player.

And for those moaning about us holding out for too high an offer, for me it would be £20m + add ons, have a look at the thread I started on South American players and the fees that are being quoted.

Unless we make a stand we will continue to be taken for mugs.
 
Now and forever said:
Players playing in Scotland are guaged on Champions League performances and International etc when it comes to bigger fees being spent. Performances in Scotland only take you so far.

We know how good Alfie is but clubs outside of us need more to splash huge cash.
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Tierney, as an example, has played the grand total of 6 matches in the Champions League proper in his entire career. Some would have you believe that fact alone makes him worth more than Tav. It’s not a valid argument.
 
So our season is all about should he go or stay, for what ever figure floats yer boat.

Let’s just get in about it and win silverware.
 
Valley Bluenose said:
Tierney, as an example, has played the grand total of 6 matches in the Champions League proper in his entire career. Some would have you believe that fact alone makes him worth more than Tav. It’s not a valid argument.
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Along with international games it is.

Thats just the way it is in Scotland.
 
Morelos guarantees us 30+ goals this season. I don't use the word lightly but he did it last year (even with a horrendous disciplinary record) and he'll do it again this year - absolutely no doubt about it.

A replacement, regardless of fee or pedigree, does not offer that guarantee.

We have to keep unless the fee is 20 mil+. Even then, it's a tough call. Frankfurt do have cash burning a hole in their pocket right enough so who knows...
 
Valley Bluenose said:
It’s a crazy argument isn’t it. If only players who won things moved for big fees there would be very few big transfers every season. Fact is, most players go through their careers without winning a sausage.

Furthermore, this higher level they’ve supposedly played at consists of a maximum 6 games every other season.
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It’s ridiculous to assert that we should expect more for Morelos than Celtic got for Dembele if you’re directly comparing the two in working out your evaluation.

Nothing Morelos has done to date trumps what the French kid achieved for the Yahoos.

I don’t like admitting it, but it’s just a fact.

He scored goals in the CL, Alfie hasn’t.

He helped his (former) club to the title and both cups, Alfie hasn’t.

He scored goals in crucial head to heads between the clubs, Alfie hasn’t.

These things do come into play when fees are calculated; it’s ridiculous to argue otherwise.
 
SG and his team have coached AM since the season ended

i would rather have a more mature AM next season than a 2 million replacement that wont get a yellow card

Morelos needs to be here for next season then cash in next summer
 
Now and forever said:
Along with international games it is.

Thats just the way it is in Scotland.
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I’m not sure playing in a Scotland team that’s getting horsed regularly is a valid argument either mate. Sticking with Tierney, it’s only 9 competitive games for Scotland to add to those 6 CL games. Yes, it makes a difference but I’d contend that it isn’t, and shouldn’t, be as dramatic as some would suggest.
 
Jorg said:
SG and his team have coached AM since the season ended

i would rather have a more mature AM next season than a 2 million replacement that wont get a yellow card

Morelos needs to be here for next season then cash in next summer
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Keeping Alfie could be the difference between us getting our first major silverware in 8 years , and not .

This is what people need to weigh up before jumping in with “ sell for £12 million” and other lowball sums .

I think most of us would understand if the club sold for anything over £18 million or so , but it still leaves huge boots to fill if the wee man goes .
 
drgriffen said:
For once we are in a position of strength. We don't have to sell unless our valuation is met and if it isn't we get to keep a very good player.

And for those moaning about us holding out for too high an offer, for me it would be £20m + add ons, have a look at the thread I started on South American players and the fees that are being quoted.

Unless we make a stand we will continue to be taken for mugs.
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wish all gers fans got on the bandwagon with this type of mindset...... We own a guy that's fearless regardless who he,s up against can occupy a back 4 himself scores 30+goals of all kinds has European goals and experience is only 22... Playing like a 26 year old in terms of his physical attributes... Just signed a new contract....that the manager has both backed and put a price of 20mil+ just to enter negotiations.... We hold all the cards and if no one fancies him.... A season banging goals in and upsetting the rest of the spl with give us a fantastic opportunity to challenge with strong firepower to get 55...they mock him because they fear him.... I don't fancy getti g physical with a buffalo for 90 mins... And I expect jozo and mkenna don't fancy it one bit either... Let's back our guy and his true value...
 
omegaman said:
It’s ridiculous to assert that we should expect more for Morelos than Celtic got for Dembele if you’re directly comparing the two in working out your evaluation.

Nothing Morelos has done to date trumps what the French kid achieved for the Yahoos.

I don’t like admitting it, but it’s just a fact.

He scored goals in the CL, Alfie hasn’t.

He helped his (former) club to the title and both cups, Alfie hasn’t.

He scored goals in crucial head to heads between the clubs, Alfie hasn’t.

These things do come into play when fees are calculated; it’s ridiculous to argue otherwise.
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I didn’t mention Dembele. Nor discuss his fee comparative to Morelos. Not sure if you’ve confused my point with someone else’s.

I was thinking more of Tierney and Tav and the fact that some point to the formers CL and International experience as a justification for an inflated fee. It’s 6 games in the CL proper and 9 competitive internationals. That shouldn’t attract much of a ‘premium’.
 
Valley Bluenose said:
I didn’t mention Dembele. Nor discuss his fee comparative to Morelos. Not sure if you’ve confused my point with someone else’s.

I was thinking more of Tierney and Tav and the fact that some point to the formers CL and International experience as a justification for an inflated fee. It’s 6 games in the CL proper and 9 competitive internationals. That shouldn’t attract much of a ‘premium’.
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Perhaps I’m confusing myself as I was arguing about Dembele earlier, so apologies - I’ve already stated that the proposed Tierney deal threatens to blow apart what Scottish clubs can expect for players, if it goes through.

If it’s £25m for a crocked left back, it should be considerably more for the country’s top marksman.
 
Dont-panic said:
wish all gers fans got on the bandwagon with this type of mindset...... We own a guy that's fearless regardless who he,s up against can occupy a back 4 himself scores 30+goals of all kinds has European goals and experience is only 22... Playing like a 26 year old in terms of his physical attributes... Just signed a new contract....that the manager has both backed and put a price of 20mil+ just to enter negotiations.... We hold all the cards and if no one fancies him.... A season banging goals in and upsetting the rest of the spl with give us a fantastic opportunity to challenge with strong firepower to get 55...they mock him because they fear him.... I don't fancy getti g physical with a buffalo for 90 mins... And I expect jozo and mkenna don't fancy it one bit either... Let's back our guy and his true value...
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Way I look at it: If he was playing for River or Boca what would they be looking for? It would be more than the majority seem to be thinking.

I will give an example of another Colombian, Sebastian Villa. He is a winger who Boca signed a year ago for $2m. He is a good player, but nothing special yet they want $15m for him. Most of the increase in value has come from the club he plays for as the improvement in form hasn't been that dramatic. This highlights what happens if you continually say player x is worth this. Over time clubs will realise they have to come in with a higher starting bid.
 
Valley Bluenose said:
I’m not sure playing in a Scotland team that’s getting horsed regularly is a valid argument either mate. Sticking with Tierney, it’s only 9 competitive games for Scotland to add to those 6 CL games. Yes, it makes a difference but I’d contend that it isn’t, and shouldn’t, be as dramatic as some would suggest.
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It's games against higher quality and games players going for big money are judged on.
 
Now and forever said:
Players playing in Scotland are guaged on Champions League performances and International etc when it comes to bigger fees being spent. Performances in Scotland only take you so far.

We know how good Alfie is but clubs outside of us need more to splash huge cash.
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Why......goalscorers win games... That's why there more expensive... The only reason the national coach for Colombia never picked him was to teach him a lesson... Then the penny drops I hope it's in our colours if not market value.. 20mill
 
ca100 said:
Absolutely no chance we are selling for less than 10.
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Of course. He’s worth more to us here than that. I think realistically we’d need to make a decision after it gets more than £15m. Those looking for more than £20m have a legitimate point though given the way the market is going.
 
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