Leverkusen, Slavia Prague, Lyon

The Golden God said:
Nevermind 20m, there's players out there well into the 50m that don't even guarantee you any success.

Arsenal just slashed 50m on Ben White and I'm not even sure I'd take him.
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I know that mate, I was using the lower end of the scale. There's players going around for crazy money, who I've never heard of.

The tv money has changed the landscape forever. Bigger the population, bigger the rewards.
 
2 of the teams mentioned are better than us it’s just a fact, even with Leverkusen losing Havertz they are still a very good team.

Slavia were very well coached and street smart as well if that makes sense. That’s gonna happen, this isn’t SPL quality we’re playing.
 
IMO I don't think Slavia Prague were really a better team than us, same with Malmo.

Leverkusen and Lyon on the other hand, different story.
 
We are right to question the recruitment this summer so far. Its a long season but early signs are that our strongest 11 is the same from last season
 
IbroxForever said:
I got dogs abuse when i said our recruitment has been very poor
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Despite what many might have you believe our signings in the past two windows only strengthen the squad, not one of the new faces is a guaranteed starter. Not a criticism, we just don't have the funds to buy quality players.

We toiled tonight, no one in our midfield or attack had the guile too open up a defence. Thankfully we won't play a side of Lyon's quality too often, they never got out of 2nd gear tonight.
 
lovenkrands72 said:
And that investment is not coming because everyone involved has invested to get us where we are.
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It requires Champions League income and/ or significant players sales. However, those sales need replaced and the recruitment needs to be spot on or you risk weakening squad and wasting potentially tens of millions of pounds.
 
People who think that we should be beating the CL semi-finalists a couple of years back need to get their heads checked. A moment of class and a daft moment from Kent edged it for them.

It’s annoying to lose but given where we’ve been, it’s unrealistic to think that we should be on Lyon’s level right now and as for the recruitment, it’s easy to improve a sh*te team, adding touches of quality to a good team is the hard part and that’s where we are right now (with no transfer budget to do so).

As for the new signings, I thought Lundstram grew into a good performance and if Davis had that kind of game the “Davis strolled it” brigade would be out in full force. As for Sakala, Gerrard admitted he rushed him in too early, both guys need time to grow in this side, I hope both start on Sunday.
 
They were just a higher quality than us .It does take a lot of money to get players of their quality. We have done pretty well given the money we have been able to spend.
 
None of this seasons signings have improved the team they've only made the squad bigger not better.
 
Numans_Left_Peg said:
Shocking take there mate.

He was starved of any serious service what so ever and the scraps he had he kept the ball or won free kicks.

We were poor but if you think we would be better without Alfie up top then I just don't agree.
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Think Morelos needs to do more, too static in the first half.Sometimes you need to create your own openings/chances.
 
Next game in EL is Sparta Prague.
They scudded scum home and away 4-1 last season.
Are we ready for them?
 
sammy1872 said:
We can’t afford a guarenteed marquee for the Europa league . They cost 15-20 million . Look at what we rate our best players at . That’s the market you need to shop in to guarentee success at this level . Now what we can do is buy 1 in the 7-10 million pound market and you have a decent chance at success. Examples in Scotland are Kent (this season aside so far) and eduoard. But even in that range you don’t guarantee success or consistency

we will also struggle to get past the last 32/16 of the Europa league because we come up against teams with massive budgets . We need out of Scotland if we ever want to compete at Lyons or say Leverkusens level in Europe
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It was a rhetorical question.
 
The issue is that to get beyond the level of quality we have, you need to start spending big money or pull a rabbit out of the hat. The squad we have built over the last few years has been brilliant but to get to the next level you need a different kind of player and we struggle to find the money to get those types of player. You also struggle to attract them to Scotland. We have to therefore look for players who have some quality and the correct mentality and hope to develop them. Based on that you’ll have some success, some will fit in with what you have and others will come up short, it doesn’t mean recruitment is ‘bad’, it means you’re playing the hand you’ve been dealt.
 
Sunnyvale_Loyal said:
What does have to do with the players we've bought who have failed to improve us?
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The OP is questioning what is holding us back from competing with Lyons and Leverkusen's.

Then lists a bunch of players that we signed for free out the bargain bin.

Maybe we should have beat them to Boateng and Emerson on loan instead of Sakala and Ludstrum?
 
Davester said:
Leverkusen and Lyon may be CL level. But not top CL, ie Bayern, Juve, Atletico, Chelsea etc. Maybe our level is Europa, and that's that.
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Undoubtedly Europa is our level, we just need the CL money, and if we can get it often enough, we will sign better players. Simple really.
 
Bum chin said:
None of this seasons signings have improved the team they've only made the squad bigger not better. I can’t see why this is a bad thing.
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I accept it’d be better to increase the first eleven but this isn’t always easy and is usually costly.
Much more important, for me, to increase the support quality.
 
Leverkusen & Lyon are miles ahead of us. I wouldn’t bracket Slavia in with them, we played poorly to lose to them after a good away result.

But we can’t compete financially with these clubs and our chance for a bit of catch up got fcuked when we shot ourselves in the foot v Malmo.
 
Amazing how people watching the same game view players performances

I thought Alfie was superb tonight up against a cb partnership consisting of a World Cup winner with over 70 odd caps for Germany and a current Belgium (#1 rank) cb

His link up play tonight and hold up play was his best I've seen in a good while, he was let down by others around him not reaching his level of performance

Maybe its me that is wrong wrong and he's pish and sakala should be in as suggested...
 
dunn1872 said:
Honestly, what a rid neck that is.
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Merely a suggestion on the internet :) don't think he's playing anywhere near his best and hasn't been for a while.. he's great when he's great. Would like to think we are bold enough to rotate / change when we are poor. As simple as that.
 
Itsjoeariboooooooo said:
Most of our aces have been playing this season and it's been very shite. So based on your metaphor, take a ace out. Yes.
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Shite but still top of the league?
Well, I’m going to wait for something bad to happen before I get too down.
Tonight isn’t one of those nights although losing out to Malmö was.
 
Coisty87 said:
Amazing how people watching the same game view players performances

I thought Alfie was superb tonight up against a cb partnership consisting of a World Cup winner with over 70 odd caps for Germany and a current Belgium (#1 rank) cb

His link up play tonight and hold up play was his best I've seen in a good while, he was let down by others around him not reaching his level of performance

Maybe its me that is wrong wrong and he's pish and sakala should be in as suggested...
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My post on it was more out of curiosity to see what Sakala is like as a 9. Alfredo is brilliant but I think his goal return in recent months has been poor. I'd be interested to see Sakala play.
 
Coisty87 said:
Amazing how people watching the same game view players performances

I thought Alfie was superb tonight up against a cb partnership consisting of a World Cup winner with over 70 odd caps for Germany and a current Belgium (#1 rank) cb

His link up play tonight and hold up play was his best I've seen in a good while, he was let down by others around him not reaching his level of performance

Maybe its me that is wrong wrong and he's pish and sakala should be in as suggested...
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Our poorer players tonight were ones you might have hung your hat on to be good.
Davis, Kamara and Aribo for me.
 
tazzabear said:
Shite but still top of the league?
Well, I’m going to wait for something bad to happen before I get too down.
Tonight isn’t one of those nights although losing out to Malmö was.
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It's great we are top of the league etc but you can't say the start to the season has blown any of us away so far. Performances have been so poor. Dunfermline, Celtic second half and maybe County aside it's been pretty poor.

Tonight was poor, easily dismissed by it being Lyon but we were low energy and offered little again.

I am pretty sure we will come good... I am not panicking or having a go. Merely throwing it out there that we need to see more of the squad to freshen up the stale performances so far.
 
tazzabear said:
Our poorer players tonight were ones you might have hung your hat on to be good.
Davis, Kamara and Aribo for me.
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Agreed, I think Alfie, Balogun and Lundstram done well. Wouldn't say Tav, Borna or Goldson had bad games, quiet. Wright looked lively when on, Davis poor, Kent terrible etc
 
Itsjoeariboooooooo said:
It's great we are top of the league etc but you can't say the start to the season has blown any of us away so far. Performances have been so poor. Dunfermline, Celtic second half and maybe County aside it's been pretty poor.

Tonight was poor, easily dismissed by it being Lyon but we were low energy and offered little again.

I am pretty sure we will come good... I am not panicking or having a go. Merely throwing it out there that we need to see more of the squad to freshen up the stale performances so far.
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First paragraph, results are much more important than performances and, until we get points for artistic impression, it will always be thus.
Second paragraph, Lyon are a top quality side, genuine CL material and will be amongst the favourites for this competition.
I can’t agree that we offered little but we were well in it up till they scored and for most of the first half.
I remember Kent, Lundstram and Morelos having decent chances in the game.
Third paragraph, we’ll just need to wait and see.
 
Itsjoeariboooooooo said:
My post on it was more out of curiosity to see what Sakala is like as a 9. Alfredo is brilliant but I think his goal return in recent months has been poor. I'd be interested to see Sakala play.
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Wasn't intended as a dig mate, just an observation as I've seen some people say Alfie was poor tonight etc and I thought he was brilliant, all opinions.

I also would like to see Sakala, he's falling into the Itten category for me and I think he is more suited to our play than Ced was. Not sure how he would fair in one the wide three positions with his pace. I don't think he's the type of CF that will drop in and hold it up like Alfie, see him more as the type that will run beyond from wide berth
 
Coisty87 said:
Wasn't intended as a dig mate, just an observation as I've seen some people say Alfie was poor tonight etc and I thought he was brilliant, all opinions.

I also would like to see Sakala, he's falling into the Itten category for me and I think he is more suited to our play than Ced was. Not sure how he would fair in one the wide three positions with his pace. I don't think he's the type of CF that will drop in and hold it up like Alfie, see him more as the type that will run beyond from wide berth
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Aye, seems lots of folk thought Alfie was probably our best player... So I'm starting to doubt myself hahaha

I agree, think Sakala is more suited to our play than Ced.

Just genuinely interested to see what Sakala could be like, next 3 games Motherwell, Livi and Dundee could be a decent opportunity to see his level. He's hardly kicked a ball apart from Madrid and Livi and been sent on with 20 mins to go etc.

Mainly curiosity for me! I trust the gaffer knows a thing or two more about the game than me :D
 
We threw away a golden opportunity to take a major step forward vs Malmo. Level on aggregate and them down to 10 men. Keep the ball and defend properly and we could and should have beat them.
Against Slavia we were ahead on away goals coming back to Ibrox. Same as Malmo keep the ball and defend properly and we are through.
Tonight we shot ourselves in the foot again.
Leverkusan were a different class to us
For me the league is far more important than Europe this season, with the automatic CL qualifying
Please don't muck this up
 
LyonGer said:
3 teams we have lost by 2 goals in Europe.
We obliviously need to improve to compete.
Sakala has shown nothing so far.
Wright is a bit to hasty.
Lundstram not his worst game but is he an improvement?
This is not bashing any player as there was mistakes all over the park tonight.
Bacuna we haven't seen.
Simpson looks like he has a lot to do
Oboforth he has some health issues so a pass.
That's our recruitment in last 2 windows.
I'm not convinced any of them better the team.
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Hold on a minute , another recruitment went wrong thread , how original FFS :D
 
LyonGer said:
3 teams we have lost by 2 goals in Europe.
We obliviously need to improve to compete.
Sakala has shown nothing so far.
Wright is a bit to hasty.
Lundstram not his worst game but is he an improvement?
This is not bashing any player as there was mistakes all over the park tonight.
Bacuna we haven't seen.
Simpson looks like he has a lot to do
Oboforth he has some health issues so a pass.
That's our recruitment in last 2 windows.
I'm not convinced any of them better the team.
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Maybe the need some time to combine and level up . Players can do these things mate .
 
steve1873 said:
We have reached our ceiling. We are, without significant investment in playing squad, at best a last 32/ last 16 Europa League side.
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I think until we develop good quality players from our Youth department this could be a significant point .
and show patience with other new signings and the collective group
 
Der Berliner said:
Plenty, but Lyon spent 2 x 18m on their Brazilian on show tonight, the rest were freebies (Boateng ;-) ) and people from their own youth-system. Then again, that`s the Lyon youth system.

But what strange comparisons? Leverkusen is a true CL team who has spent loads of cash and got loads of cash too, and we were still in Covid-19 trance and pre-season. They were had and shoulders above us.

Slavia was when our bubble had burst for 55 and we didn`t get going at all after that.

Malmö is a team that was 12 games into their league campaign, while we had a handful of pre-season bouts. Wonder how we would fare against teams in pre-season that we would play at the end of November (for that, by comparison, that would be our 12th MD). Why UEFA arranges that shyte year after year is the question that needs answered.

Dunno why we need to point these teams out ... and "forget" all the games when we beat "far better" European sides than us under SG so far. Sometimes one needs to take defeat on the chin, even though, like tonight, you know that it could and should have been better. It is still a learning process for these players and SG ... and games like Malmö and Lyon show us that we are not there by quite a distance - even though I would like to think that we skip the play-acting and cheating bits employed by Malmö and tonight`s opponents. Obviously, quite a few of the real CL teams out there on Tuesday and Wednesday would have hammered us in our current state ... and no real shame about it.
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the numbers I seen rated OL Group as a half billion euro company . That’s the reality .

of course we aim to do better with what we have and we can but we must also develop better players ASAP .
 
We've had a few seasons now of reaching certain levels and better sides and now knowing what we'll be up against and where to improve.

Leverkusen then Slavia should've shown us what we'll need to be at to reach the Champions League and it looks like we've totally stagnated in that regard.
 
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