Not bad for going backwards under SG
- Thread starter Gazb1962
- Start date
Jjbscotty
Well-Known Member
For the second year running.
yawn. gone further in Europe. your arguments are flawed as well as tedious
Brother Crockett
Well-Known Member
We could have/should have put some diddy teams away- no doubt. But, to me, it’s the mid range games which are our problem. The Sheep, The Watery Farts, Killie. The teams who, on their day, can raise their game just enough.
And it’s the same, a couple of players out, missed chances, two instances of the referee cheating and we drop points.
If we fix those, we are golden. Straight up against Celtic, we are better. With proper referees we match and beat mid level European teams, never mind mid -Level Scottish teams
And it’s the same, a couple of players out, missed chances, two instances of the referee cheating and we drop points.
If we fix those, we are golden. Straight up against Celtic, we are better. With proper referees we match and beat mid level European teams, never mind mid -Level Scottish teams
Jjbscotty
Well-Known Member
So if we don’t get out the group stage next season then pressure should be on gerrard since that would be regression?
Carson's Cat
Well-Known Member
The worst case for us this season is:
2nd in the Premiership
LC Losers
Losing 1/4 finalist in the SC (if we get pumped tomorrow)
Last 16 of the EU (if we get pumped by BL)
By most measures that is a good season and, if you're unhappy with it, then come up with a creative alternative. There are, though, only two:
1. Bin The Gaffer and start again
2. Reset in July and improve incrementally.
You may well be, "disgusted at the way we’ve thrown the league away" but go on - chose one of those options.
RFC_Champions
I Make Stuff Up
Completely disagree that your hypothetical scenario would be classed as a “good season”
One specifics that really does matter is whether we finish 2nd play GD, 1pt or 12pts +
Ultimately it’s still a second place finish but the “gap” can be reflective of “progress”
I wouldn’t bin the gaffer in July either way but he must start delivering a serious and sustained league challenge throughout the course of the season and not just until December. Everything else (cups etc) is a bonus and does not provide an alternative to the main objective of the league.
BlueSeaOfIbrox
Well-Known Member
Nobody said we're not concerned about our league form over the past few weeks.
There's a difference between being concerned and being a roaster (as the other thread calls you) and wanting him sacked.
Jjbscotty
Well-Known Member
It’s not only two weeks though it’s two years in a row that we’ve blew it from a very good position.
Its-Sebo
Well-Known Member
Who said we've gone backwards under Gerrard? They need their mouth rinsed out with bleach.
The team has made exceptional strides forward but our bread and butter is the league and it's clear from our collapse over the last two months that Gerrard still hasn't figured that out.
He's young, inexperienced and learning so he gets another shot at it but regardless of how good the team are playing and how well we're doing in Europe, if he can't mount a serious league challenge next season he's out.
The team has made exceptional strides forward but our bread and butter is the league and it's clear from our collapse over the last two months that Gerrard still hasn't figured that out.
He's young, inexperienced and learning so he gets another shot at it but regardless of how good the team are playing and how well we're doing in Europe, if he can't mount a serious league challenge next season he's out.
Danger Zone
Just the tip...
Yeah I’m just bewildered that you believe that hypothetical scenario constitutes a ‘good’ season. Yikes.
But since option 2 isn’t a anyway a guarantee and you can’t just snap your fingers and make it happen; in that hypothetical scenario....you replace the manager, just like every club does in those scenarios and just like every fan here would want if the manager in question wasn’t named Steven Gerrard.
Carson's Cat
Well-Known Member
It isn't a 'hypothetical scenario'. It's realistically the worst case scenario.
Danger Zone
Just the tip...
Sense at last. And the first bit is actually something I forgot to touch on, I honestly haven’t seen anyone say we’ve gone backwards, I’ve seen plenty of folk say that we’ve already stalled and hit a plateau domestically, but then thats not really something people can argue when there’s hard evidence to suggest that’s the case.
Carson's Cat
Well-Known Member
So 1. it isn't a "hypothetical scenario". This is the worst our season will be and 2. If it stays as such are you really suggesting we bin the manager?
Danger Zone
Just the tip...
Oh for fecks sake. No one knows how our season will end right now so of course it’s hypothetical. And 2. Yes, did I not make that clear previously? If we don’t buck up our ideas and take a trophy and the outcome of the season is chucking the league away in January (again) and a cracking run at Europe you’d have to look at finding an experienced manager with a track record of delivering trophies.
No other manager would survive two trophy-less seasons at Rangers and regardless of his profile and what impact that has on the clubs profile, Gerrard probably shouldn’t be any different. If not, then you face blowing it for a third season in which case you’re probably going to want them to make that change you were so reluctant to make the previous season anyway.
depends how we are doing in the league. Swings and roundabouts on how you measure progress year on year. Not always as simple as measuring LFL
The Lone Ranger
Well-Known Member
Ssshhhh dont get in the way of the pointscoring
Carson's Cat
Well-Known Member
We can't perform worse than I stated so, of course, it isn't hypothetical.
So if we do as badl as I outlined would you like to bin Gerard and start again? A one word answer, if you can manage it, would be great.
Danger Zone
Just the tip...
I’ve not only answered the question previously I’ve even explained why I think that decision would/should be taken. Why does it need to be a one word answer, is an answer in excess of a single word more than you can comprehend? The answer is YES.
As for the first bit, you’re winding me up, I refuse to believe you are that daft.
To be honest I only joined last week but have yet to grasp how it all works. I’ve posted a few things and replies mostly in support of the gaffer and people can agree or disagree. What I ain’t is a wrong un as someone has said. I don’t even know if it was directed at me or not but if it was I have people on here who can certainly vouch for me. If it wasn’t directed at me I’m sorry.
The Lone Ranger
Well-Known Member
If we had to go on last season and previous should option 2 not be changed to reset and improve untill xmas and then watch the league slip away?
I inow thats not ideal but its more factual than your option 2
The Lone Ranger
Well-Known Member
Its crazy to think that when we are still celebrating a great victory that people on here are still trying to get one up on other (from both sides of the argument)
We have to accept some want the manager to stay and some dont. No one knownwhat will happen and who is right or wrong but while we keep attacking each other is going to be a harder journey than it has to be. Comments like he is going to win everything 100% and he needs to be sacked are not factual and dont do anything but wind people up
We have to accept some want the manager to stay and some dont. No one knownwhat will happen and who is right or wrong but while we keep attacking each other is going to be a harder journey than it has to be. Comments like he is going to win everything 100% and he needs to be sacked are not factual and dont do anything but wind people up
Carson's Cat
Well-Known Member
I am happy to be daft/simple-minded but the notion of binning Gerard is, to me, insane.
Aye, we've fucked the league - again - but I love the sense of well-being that he has brought to the club and, for sure, we're on the right path.
The Lone Ranger
Well-Known Member
You are right, the club seems more stable now and that is what is best for us. Its disappointing we are out the rwce do early and in my opinion show no signs of how to get back in it. We are where we are and the manager and ppayers will all have to answer for it at the end of the season. The ones that make the grade will stay and the ones that dont will go, its the same everywhere
Carson's Cat
Well-Known Member
I think we have to stay on track. Stability is what matters most and we can all see we're building something good here.
Commentator
Well-Known Member
That comes across as genuine. My concern is someone who wasn't interested enough in FF to register until very recently is now apparently motivated enough to start a thread, very similar to several previously posted, having a dig at bears which will lead to pointscoring.
Jjbscotty
Well-Known Member
So you’re a Steven Gerrard fan first and foremost?
tazzabear
Well-Known Member
You can’t consider one without considering the other though.
That is what is/was happening since the break.
The Lone Ranger
Well-Known Member
Stability does matter but ultimately its a results business
Carson's Cat
Well-Known Member
Immaterial. Our current regime is doing wonders for the club and the notion of changing it simply never occurred to me.
tazzabear
Well-Known Member
No, for me, there are more questions to ask.
For example,
Where were we April 2018?
Have we progressed since then?
Can we hire a different manager who can guarantee anything better than what the current one is achieving.
Slim Jim
Well-Known Member
I think some of us are getting carried away after Wednesday night, its easy done. We Have played 120 minutes of decent football this year, we have won nothing, we have dropped points to dross in Scotland. Lets see what we have at the end of the season.
Glass half empty loyal.
Glass half empty loyal.
Jimbo 1690
Well-Known Member
Yeah but would you give him more time if he fails next year???? FWIW I would as I happen to think we’ve got the right man, I just think we should allow him time to gain his experience
I think if he fails next year he would leave by choice. Having said that he might still win a trophy this year you never know.
I’m not his fan club or anything like that I just think he’s the best man for the job and I think he’ll get it right.
He’s definitely drawing attention to us again with our European performances.
Apparently there was a long list of scouts at the game on Thursday and I don’t think they were there just to watch Braga players.
Beckhambear2
Well-Known Member
Would it be a good idea to get rid of one of the biggest names in football? Seriously?
Does anyone consider the steep learning curve he is on as a young manager and how we could reap the benefits if we don’t have a knee jerk reaction to a couple of poor results?
Remember we lost a cup final to an offside goal. Still in the Scottish cup (hopefully longer than until tomorrow) still in Europe when our season started in July and on track for a brilliant points tally in league. That is not a record to sack the manager, who will take back room staff with him and throw all the hard work they have done away.
Have some faith and belief in our team and management and stop looking to see what Celtic are doing. Look at our journey instead
Does anyone consider the steep learning curve he is on as a young manager and how we could reap the benefits if we don’t have a knee jerk reaction to a couple of poor results?
Remember we lost a cup final to an offside goal. Still in the Scottish cup (hopefully longer than until tomorrow) still in Europe when our season started in July and on track for a brilliant points tally in league. That is not a record to sack the manager, who will take back room staff with him and throw all the hard work they have done away.
Have some faith and belief in our team and management and stop looking to see what Celtic are doing. Look at our journey instead
LisburnLoyalBear
Well-Known Member
Just come out and say it. You want Gerrard gone. As for your last paragraph, says more about you than anyone else.
Danger Zone
Just the tip...
If we continue to win nothing, then yes, I’ll want him gone, it’s a big IF. I’m not interested in second placed finishes.
What does it say about me? That I hold Rangers to a higher standard and I’ve not turned into some star struck wee lassie that’s just happy to have a famous manager? Away and do one pal.
aye but the way you go on and on and on and on about it comes across as you want him gone now. That's what your underlying message appears to be. We all want to get winning again, no-one is arguing about that
Danger Zone
Just the tip...
If it was a simple case of me wanting him gone I’d jd just say that. The back and forth is really down to being repeatedly challenged on my view that blowing the league in January 2 years running isn’t satisfactory domestic progress. Like I said before, I think some just don’t want to deal with the reality because it’s not exactly easy to take.
BigBuff
Well-Known Member
Out of curiosity what do you expect from the rest of this season now?
Danger Zone
Just the tip...
A serious upturn in league form (albeit too little too late) and the Scottish Cup. I won’t be rubbing my hands at another trophyless season thats for sure.
HandsomeHead
Well-Known Member
You’re kidding yourself on.
It’s not just the games we’ve dropped points in, its all of them since the new year.
Had we been scudding everyone else 3, 4 and 5 nil (as we actually did last year during our ‘bad patch’) I could have sort of understood it, but we’ve struggled unconvincingly to wins in all our other games, even Hamilton in the cup where two goals in the past few minutes gave the scoreline a far healthier sheen than our performance really merited.
The big frustration for me is that Gerrard should have changed things around much earlier than he has done, and even then it isn’t guaranteed he’ll persist with it.
Europe has been great, way off the scale in terms of expectations, but our title challenges, this one especially, have been really poor and unless he finds a way to revive our fortunes domestically, continental success is unlikely to sustain him.
BigBuff
Well-Known Member
I'd agree the form has to change in the league and would like the Scottish cup, so if we dont get the Scottish cup you think it's time for a new manager?
Truffle Shuffle
Well-Known Member
Yup, you either love him unconditionally and celebrate his successes and turn a complete blond eye to his failures. Or you hate him and can't be happy when things go right. There's only black and white.
gersfanal
Well-Known Member
I understand your angst which is shared by many on here and elsewhere but, whose fault is it that we have crashed and burned in the league since the break ?
For me there are some players who seem to think that they have earned total respect on the basis of past results. If SG has coached the first team squad to achieve brilliant results in the Europa League then I don't reckon he is doing much wrong. Perhaps we just need a better Sports psychologist ( excuse spelling ) as, for sure, we are better than them, Aberdeen, Kilmarnock, Hearts and Hibernian not to mention the other dross.
For those who suggest giving Steven Gerrard a further season after which, if he hasn't delivered, he needs to 'go' , they need to get help. I, for one, rejoice in the fact that we have SG as manager but, for those who don't, just tell me who the hell they would accept as their preferred manager and who would do a better job.
As they say, 'be careful what you wish for'
Jimbo 1690
Well-Known Member
Like you I think he’s the right guy, Christ, for all those saying we signed an inexperienced manager, the how the hell has he managed to outsmart these European managers and Lennon if he doesn’t have what it takes......definitely worth persevering with, just as Man U did with Fergie
Sheik Ma Shammy
Well-Known Member
We need to be much better in the league and win a cup, but we have improved under Gerrard anyone saying we have not I just cant understand how they see it like that.
prenzlauerbear
Well-Known Member
That's kinda where I imagine where the powers upstairs are as well.
Traditionally, winning is the be-all and end-all at Rangers. "Not everything, the only thing" etc. It's a great soundbite but one that's not really applicable in the current reality. The fans think emotionally and are entitled to demand that — we're Rangers, after all — but at board room level there's undoubtedly more realism.
Given the unprecedented scale of what we've been through, I would be shocked if Gerrard's KPIs (sorry for the work speak) upon signing his contract were just "win trophies". He's not stupid, and wouldn't have taken the job on with the remit of undoing Celtic's grip on Scottish football within a couple of seasons. Unsurprisingly, the reality of managing a major football club football is way more nuanced than that.
Rather, I'm thinking he'll be judged on things like improving the squad value and standard of player (he has done), re-establishing the club in Europe (he has done, and exceeded), and closing the gap on Celtic for a proper title shot in year three (he has done, albeit not fast enough for some). I wouldn't be surprised if they also expected a domestic trophy in year two, which to be fair, we came pretty close to achieving and still could.
@DylanGer, I think, made a good thread in the summer about patience, or the lack thereof it, when it comes to Rangers, and why that worried him when it came to us trying the "project" approach. Even if we're slowly closing the gap on Celtic, some fans only see failure as failure, without bringing context into it. In the Walter Smith years, we had every right to think that way, but in the current climate, it's just not realistic.
The Lone Ranger
Well-Known Member
Are you suggesting its the players fault? We cant break down teams that sit in, that requires a tactical change and that comes from the top
