Our record in 'big' domestic games since 18/19.

Over riding feeling is this team needs ripped apart and rebuilt

So many of them we can't trust to bring the success we all want
 
After beating them in the first game at Parkhead last season, they were never close enough to us before an Old Firm game for us to be under any pressure.

We went miles in front well before Xmas due to them spilling umpteen points, so once the run in came we were so far ahead there was no pressure on us.

Don't get me wrong, we were magnificent, just saying that by killing the league race so early the type of pressure we've folded under in the other 3 seasons never happened.
 
CaptainCourageous said:
I literally cannot wait to see the back of these players. The more we can get rid of, the better. All players out of contract need moved on. A number need sold - I’ll throw Aribo, Kent and Morelos (sadly) into that hat.

They have delivered one trophy which is pathetic. That’s not made up for the ones who get annoyed about that stat.

Sadly I’m not impressed with the sporting director or manager so mediocrity will continue. Especially since we’ve squandered two potential Champions League windfalls and have little money.
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How do we replace them.
What players are out there that get the club that can replace McGregor, Davis and Arfield for a start. Impossible.
Where do we get the next Morelos who will take a while to develop, where do we find a 50K bargain like Kamara.
I think 5 or 6 leaving replaced by 3 or 4 quality players is best we can hope for.
We could really struggle next season.
 
chickenhawk said:
How do we replace them.
What players are out there that get the club that can replace McGregor, Davis and Arfield for a start. Impossible.
Where do we get the next Morelos who will take a while to develop, where do we find a 50K bargain like Kamara.
I think 5 or 6 leaving replaced by 3 or 4 quality players is best we can hope for.
We could really struggle next season.
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Christ sake
 
Pirlo said:
It’s in the nature of a lot of fans to always search for positives, desperately sometimes. For example even when we went on little winning runs at the end of Gerrard’s first two season’s AFTER we’d pissed the league away and let them build up huge leads, there were plenty who sighted that as a sign that we were gelling, finding form, starting to right the wrongs etc. The reality? It was a team benefiting hugely from playing with the pressure off. I feel like everything that’s happened since is further proof of this.

I’ve taken a torrent abuse at various times for suggesting these players have no bottle. But even then I could tell some people had an inclination that this was the case, but they just couldn’t handle facing up to the reality. But those results laid bare are jarring, and they show a conclusive pattern that cannot be ignored.
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It gets to a point you have to calmly asses - the litany of failure is inescapable.

The results are there for all to see, I really object to people claiming this is hysteria or overreaction after a bad result. We've had nearly 4 seasons of most of these players now, that's a hell of sample size to ignore.
 
Carlisle Bear said:
2018/19
Lose League Cup semi-final 1-0 Aberdeen.
Lose Scottish Cup quarter-final 2-0 Aberdeen.
Go top of the league in December by winning at Hearts, lose 1-0 at home to Aberdeen to relinquish top spot 3 days later.
Collapse post winter break.
Lose deciding OF game 2-1.

2019/20
Lose League Cup final Celtic 1-0
Lose Scottish Cup quarter-final 1-0 Hearts.
Go top of the league in October by winning against Hamilton, draw 1-1 away to Hearts to relinquish top spot in the next game.
Collapse post winter break.
League called early.

2020/21
Lose League Cup quarter-final 3-2 St Mirren.
Lose Scottish Cup quarter-final on penalties St Johnstone.
55 - Glorious, but with no fans in the grounds, to mention this is to talk down an achievement that means so much to us, no matter your opinion on that this season looks like the exception rather than the rule.

2021/22
Lose League Cup semi-final 3-1 Hibs.
Collapse post winter break.
Lose deciding OF game 2-1 which results in a 12 point swing since December.

I'll caveat the above by pointing out the European performances across this period have been outstanding and there may be some big games in there where we have won yet ultimately resulted in no silverware (few OF wins, beat Hearts 1-0 in a semi final).

What are people's overriding opinion of this team as it ends it's cycle? I know it's not over yet.
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A more one sided, biased post you’ll struggle to find on FF. Some serious spin going on here.
 
Carlisle Bear said:
What results are not correct?
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Very good if a bit desperate.

The thread is titled “our record in big domestic games since 18/19”

As far as I can see you’ve only listed the big domestic games we’ve lost. What about all the big domestic games we’ve won?

I guess it puts the type of slant on your post that you want.

If you want a serious debate about it don’t try and pull the wool over peoples eyes.
 
The Gallant Pioneer said:
Very good if a bit desperate.

The thread is titled “our record in big domestic games since 18/19”

As far as I can see you’ve only listed the big domestic games we’ve lost. What about all the big domestic games we’ve won?

I guess it puts the type of slant on your post that you want.

If you want a serious debate about it don’t try and pull the wool over peoples eyes.
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I listed the cup results and key OF matches, I omitted some OF wins and some defeats as well as they were not the critical fixture in that season.

If you want to try and put a positive results on the cup results for example then go right ahead.
 
Carlisle Bear said:
I listed the cup results and key OF matches, I omitted some OF wins and some defeats as well as they were not the critical fixture in that season.

If you want to try and put a positive results on the cup results for example then go right ahead.
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You listed what you wanted to list in a way that supported your argument.

Unfortunately your evidence is bogus as it only shows half the story.
 
I'll never judge our players harshly, as I can see for myself what they are up against every week. They need to beat the opposition and the officials. That's why I relished 55. It was an incredible achievement, up there with anything since I first went to Ibrox in 1974.
 
sandbankbear said:
To think we won several trophies with guys like jig. Edu. Broadfoot and even ricky foster in our side. It takes more than just talent.
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It’s funny to think that after Dortmund we had a majority vote on here to say that the current team would have beaten Walter Smith’s team from the UEFA Cup final.

Looks really daft now.
 
I agree with most on here. Last season was magical league wise and they were rightly lauded for it however the other failures were down to various reasons that most have covered. However, the one characteristic I think has been the main issue is the lack of hunger for success and this season has confirmed that to me big time. For the vast majority of these players they had two opportunities in their whole careers to play in the CL and both almost handed to them on a plate and both were allowed to slip by without as much as a whimper. Firstly they just had to see out 45 minutes against 10 man Malmo and when they blew that they just had to win a league against low quality duffers and a Celtic team in chaos and I can't get my head round the lack of desire to achieve these things. Big caveat to the above being if we win the EL or manage to get through CL qualifiers.
 
Supersonic2.0 said:
so 1 in 4 years? the other 3 absolutely abysmal?
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Abysmal? No.

First season we saw some progress. Those that were expecting 55 were utterly delusional.

Second season we looked to have the beating of them before inexplicably imploding then the pandemic ended it early.

This season looks like it’s one too far for the current group of players, something I and several others expressed concern about last summer.

The context is that a club still finding its feet after the events of ten years ago and one that was and still is operating at a considerable financial disadvantage to its fiercest rivals, managed to, not just win but absolutely streak its way to a record breaking title triumph preventing the Yahoos from recording their holy grail in the process.
 
Dennistounbear45 said:
Conceding late goals has been a trait since Gerrard's first season.
Click to expand...

So it’s absolutely no surprise that it’s still happening when 4 years later it’s the same GK, RB, main CB and until very recently the same LB

The lack of evolution of the starting 11 means the same players are constantly throwing up the same results

Can’t wait for the clear out
 
DylanGer said:
There's not really a debate over this-the over riding opinion is that this squad are weak mentally and fail in big games they shouldn't.

You can argue to the cows come home how important 55 was and in Europe as the OP points out we've been punching above our weight since SG arrived with the exception of this season's CL qualifier.

It would take a minor miracle this season for that view to change.

I take a more pragmatic view that I didn't think we would make 55 with the resources we had but there's little point arguing about how poor we've been especially in the cups.
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We got 55 because of the arrogance of the Celtic board, who thought that a few loan signings would be enough to win the league, the same as our board this season, had the filth board shelled out a few million, I doubt if 55 would have happened.
 
Yesterday when chasing the game, we were rushing passes to guys that had turned their backs and thumping clearances to nobody.

The team don't know how to follow a process to the end. We abandon game plans in favour of hump it into the box and hope we get lucky. That comes from the so called leadership group and its time all of them moved on. I'll really miss Tavernier's contribution from right back but he's symbolic of the bigger issue at the club and I'd rather we just started afresh and cleared all of them out.

I don't know about anyone else, but much like Goldson in the semi final, at half time yesterday I was already resigned to defeat. I'm sure I'm not alone.

The last four years will be rated about 4 or 5 out of 10.
 
ICA_86 said:
It’s funny to think that after Dortmund we had a majority vote on here to say that the current team would have beaten Walter Smith’s team from the UEFA Cup final.

Looks really daft now.
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Looked dafter at the time and exposed the stupidity of far too many who were over excited.

Stand to be corrected when we win in Seville all the same.:D
 
Our captain and vice captain told us the issues in the team and both times they referred to mentality. Don’t like teams getting in our faces and lack of hunger. Major issues before you then add in lack of decent attacking options, fatigue and injuries.
 
Abacab said:
It’s why I was so miffed that Gerrard was on that dream scene.

A complete failure domestically.

One trophy in nine was a genuine disgrace. Last year should have been a treble. Getting put out of cups by the likes of St Mirren and St Johnstone. We were all so delighted about the league that we gave him and the players a free ride.

That lot go for every domestic competition. We need new players who want to win.
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The only thing worse than Gerrard's cup record is the excuses for that cup record.
 
Livibear said:
They flourish in Europe where there’s no expectation, but simply don’t have the minerals to do it at home.

Too many with a weak mentality.
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Utter nonsense.

The big difference between the European results and domestic is the corrupt refs.

If you can't see or understand this I simply don't believe you.
 
dh1963 said:
After beating them in the first game at Parkhead last season, they were never close enough to us before an Old Firm game for us to be under any pressure.

We went miles in front well before Xmas due to them spilling umpteen points, so once the run in came we were so far ahead there was no pressure on us.

Don't get me wrong, we were magnificent, just saying that by killing the league race so early the type of pressure we've folded under in the other 3 seasons never happened.
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Made that point to my auld da last week. Would you have trusted Gerrard and his team to win the league if it was neck and neck every week that season? I really can't say I would have.
 
IbroxForever said:
Utter nonsense.

The big difference between the European results and domestic is the corrupt refs.

If you can't see or understand this I simply don't believe you.
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Away tae f*ck man. McGregor cost us 2 goals yesterday because the refs are corrupt?

Nonsense.
 
it’s the players fs clear as day they aren’t up to it.

Yes gio has made mistakes (constantly picking McGregor) but this group of players clearly aren’t up to the pressure of playing in Scotland. Our own players have even admitted it, our captain and vice captain ffs and Ryan Kent also said similar.
 
chickenhawk said:
How do we replace them.
What players are out there that get the club that can replace McGregor, Davis and Arfield for a start. Impossible.
Where do we get the next Morelos who will take a while to develop, where do we find a 50K bargain like Kamara.
I think 5 or 6 leaving replaced by 3 or 4 quality players is best we can hope for.
We could really struggle next season.
Click to expand...

Are you winding me up?
 
ICA_86 said:
It’s funny to think that after Dortmund we had a majority vote on here to say that the current team would have beaten Walter Smith’s team from the UEFA Cup final.

Looks really daft now.
Click to expand...
Walter’s side would absolutely slap our current side. I wouldn’t say the talent levels are drastically different but the difference in mentality is night and day.
 
We have a few players who seem to like being the underdog in games.It suits their mentality.This is what happens when you sign players who have never actually won anything..
Granted the days of signing Serie A winners may be behind us but we aren't even buying players who have won a domestic cup
 
Carlisle Bear said:
2018/19
Lose League Cup semi-final 1-0 Aberdeen.
Lose Scottish Cup quarter-final 2-0 Aberdeen.
Go top of the league in December by winning at Hearts, lose 1-0 at home to Aberdeen to relinquish top spot 3 days later.
Collapse post winter break.
Lose deciding OF game 2-1.

2019/20
Lose League Cup final Celtic 1-0
Lose Scottish Cup quarter-final 1-0 Hearts.
Go top of the league in October by winning against Hamilton, draw 1-1 away to Hearts to relinquish top spot in the next game.
Collapse post winter break.
League called early.

2020/21
Lose League Cup quarter-final 3-2 St Mirren.
Lose Scottish Cup quarter-final on penalties St Johnstone.
55 - Glorious, but with no fans in the grounds, to mention this is to talk down an achievement that means so much to us, no matter your opinion on that this season looks like the exception rather than the rule.

2021/22
Lose League Cup semi-final 3-1 Hibs.
Collapse post winter break.
Lose deciding OF game 2-1 which results in a 12 point swing since December.

I'll caveat the above by pointing out the European performances across this period have been outstanding and there may be some big games in there where we have won yet ultimately resulted in no silverware (few OF wins, beat Hearts 1-0 in a semi final).

What are people's overriding opinion of this team as it ends it's cycle? I know it's not over yet.
Click to expand...
Frightening looking at that
 
sheddensbear said:
We're fine against teams who play open, expansive football (Europe and Celtic).
We struggle with teams who make it difficult for us.
Our problem this season is our inability to score more goals. We need about 8 or 9 on target to score 1.
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And then add in if we do get a goal, as long as Tav or Borna or Goldson or any of the other defenders don’t have a complete ballsup and gift a goal, then we can depend of McGregor to throw one into his own net! We can get away with scoring only 1 or 2 if we can also defend. Now we cant do either!
 
chickenhawk said:
How do we replace them.
What players are out there that get the club that can replace McGregor, Davis and Arfield for a start. Impossible.
Where do we get the next Morelos who will take a while to develop, where do we find a 50K bargain like Kamara.
I think 5 or 6 leaving replaced by 3 or 4 quality players is best we can hope for.
We could really struggle next season.
Click to expand...
I'm sure we could easily sign 3 players in their 30's on a free that contribute the same as McGregor, Davis and Arfield have this season. Kamara been awful this season also.

We're 99.9% guarenteed 2nd next season where we are more than likely to finish this season so punting these failures is hardly catastrophic.

Quite amazed at how highly you rate them tbh.
 
It's become apparent this season that we won the league because of the state that lot got themselves into. If they'd been winning week in week out and breathing down our necks then our players would've most likely shat their pants and collapsed again.

It doesn't tarnish the title win in my eyes because it meant the absolute world and was one of the happiest and most emotional times of my life. But to be honest there'll be a few players I probably won't remember as fondly as I'd have thought I would this time last season.
 
Teddyjohn said:
This team lacks leaders and drive with little winning mentality. It has been like that since Walter Smith was manager.

As an aside, when Rangers won the European Cup Winners Cup in 1972 we beat what was practically the West German national side (Bayern Munich in the semi final) that won the European Nations Cup only weeks after we won in Barcelona.

That same season Rangers finished third in the league 16 points behind Celtic when it was 2 points for a win.
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You are 100% right about season 1971/1972.
As a 14 year old going to games I couldn't understand the contrast in form between Scotland and Europe and I still can't fathom it.
In 1972 I remember getting a 2 Nil hammering from Hibs in a Scottish Cup Semi reply a few weeks before Barca triumph. Still baffling today.
 
BrooklynBlue said:
The players obviously enjoy playing in Europe as opposed to the monotony and drudgery of Scotland. It's the reason the squad requires regular turnover - talented and ambitious players aren't going to last too long playing the likes of Motherwell four times a season.
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Then they should have been even more fired up knowing that next season for some might be the one and only time in their careers that they'd get to play in Europes ultimate competition. When they are watching celtic play in that competitiong next season they should feel sick at themselves if it is indeed an attitude problem.
 
I think we undoubtedly should have a few more cups to show for the past few seasons, but ‘1 win in 12’ is a bit disingenuous and ignores a lot of context. The team Gerrard inherited was a shambles and a million miles away from winning a trophy, within a year and a half we were desperately unlucky not to get a league cup on the board which showed the clear progress of the team at that time. We admittedly chucked two pretty straightforward goes at a cup last season, but this season we lost our manager before a semi final and still have a game to play.

I get it’s frustrating we don’t have more trophies to show for what’s been a relatively successful few years for us; but there are a variety of reasons we’ve not, it’s not simply a case of them being ‘bottlers’ or ‘mentally weak’ or whatever other lazy description people have for why football games don’t get won. It’s a squad that’s won huge games in Europe over the last four years, went eight unbeaten in Old Firms until a couple of months ago and went unbeaten to win one of the most important league titles in our modern history last season.

The lack of cups frustrates me, but I won’t be beating myself up over a few cups given how far we’ve came in Europe and in the league in that time. This season especially has been pretty shit from start to now, and an all round anti-climax, but the trophies will come as long as we continue to improve and we’re on a different level to where we were at the start of this period.

This teams been unlucky in some and undeniably blown other trophies, but I’ll never let that obfuscate what has been four years of clear and evident progress by the first Rangers side I’ve actually enjoyed watching in about ten years.
 
When Gerrard came in, if you told me he’d stop ten in the last year but win no other trophies and we’d also loose the following season (as it seems to be the case) I would’ve taken it. However, this team have reached the end. They’ve given us some special moments but it’s time to move on, WITH gio at the helm.
 
mfgorm said:
Last season we lost the cups by losing goals in the last minute, twice.
I would like to know why we collapse after the winter break, every time.
Click to expand...

It's easy to conclude tbh. Too many of them are mentally weak and ultimately, losers. We managed to focus all of last season in the league, but it's a total outlier.
 
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