Souness on the comparison between him and Gerrard

If Gerrard has left us for Liverpool then most folk would have no complaints.

He left for a club in bottom half of the league however who will never even challenge for league title.

Souness also wanted to finish the season where as Gerrard pissed off as soon as Villa flashed their knickers at him.

Likes of McAllister can't claim to be a Rangers man either now.
 
They both chose to leave, Gerrard at the timing of his choosing and souness at the timing of Murray which in fairness to Murray was a big balls decision.
Whilst Walter refused to go with souness most of us didn’t want Walter to take over at that time and were looking for a massive name to take charge.
Gerrard is self motivated and said so in the interview, this was a decision that suited him, the only thing that rankles with me is the thought that he was engineering the move for a few weeks.
 
bilkobear said:
Souness was under fire in Scotland from numerous directions.
He was the focus for all the hatreds aimed at Rangers.
He was also on the verge of serious heart illness.
However he had insisted to Liverpool that he would stay at Ibrox until that season was finished because he wanted to make the break respectful.
Murray's reaction was kneejerk and quite honestly we were lucky that we had Walter to get us over the line.
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Its fairly clear that this thread has many comments from folk who are either forgetting most of the Souness era or were not old enough to have been there at the time and simply heard it second hand from someone who was bitter about him leaving.

Let me just recap for those who either don't remember or weren't there.

In his first game Souness was sent off, fined £5000 and served a three match ban. He got sent of at the piggery in 87' and served a five match ban for telling ref David Syme exactly what he thought of him. In march 89' Souness got banned for the rest of the season after a review of a match at Tannadice in Feb when ref Andrew Waddell added on 5 minutes DU scored in extra time. Playing St Johnstone at the piggery he got his ban extended by a year because the SFA said he defied the ban and they fined him £2000. Souness even though he had effectively retired from playing had picked himself as a sub to get round the ban. Then finally in Feb 90' at Ibrox against Hearts he was filmed in the tunnel and the SFA banned him for another two years and fined him another £5000. So it was a three year touchline ban in total. Much of the above was not included in match reports but revisited via complaint.

Incidentally it wasn't over for Souness because the SFA was going to do him again for running onto the pitch after we beat Celtic in the League Cup Final 90-91' because that was also seen as a transgression of his ban in the eyes of Jim Farry.

Some people I knew were a bit pissed off that Souness left but understood it entirely especially when they new the SFA were as much a part of Souness making that decision as Murray was telling him to go now rather than at the end of the season. Besides most of us who were adults at the time knew that he would leave for Liverpool at some point.
 
bilkobear said:
It depends on the professional and how driven they are.
There is no way on God's earth that Souness wasn't going to drive his Rangers team onto the Championship that season.
Maybe as a 13 year old you didn't understand the man but Souness was a hard bitten professional winner who didn't do diminishing returns.
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Even as a 13 year old I had read his autobiography ‘No Half Measures’ from cover to cover a large number of times.
The problem is that it isn’t about the desire of the individual to go out on a high, it is whether they can get anything out of players who know their heart isn’t with the club anymore, who don’t fear them in the same way. When the stories started about Gerrard wanting to talk to Villa, my only thought was that it had to get sorted fast, and that he had to go (even if the Villa thing fell through).

The leader of the club is our manager, and they are either all in or they are out.
 
Kubala said:
Has this been confirmed anywhere?
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A few of the ex players have spoken about it, albeit one of them was Barry “the mouth” Ferguson.

I mentioned a few weeks ago I’d heard it from a first team player, who by chance I just happened to be in the company of.
 
legalbeagle said:
Even as a 13 year old I had read his autobiography ‘No Half Measures’ from cover to cover a large number of times.
The problem is that it isn’t about the desire of the individual to go out on a high, it is whether they can get anything out of players who know their heart isn’t with the club anymore, who don’t fear them in the same way. When the stories started about Gerrard wanting to talk to Villa, my only thought was that it had to get sorted fast, and that he had to go (even if the Villa thing fell through).

The leader of the club is our manager, and they are either all in or they are out.
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I can't be totally sure now but I think Souness intended to keep his departure under wraps and that the players weren't to be told.
But I would need to check that anyway.
However, are you now suggesting that Gough, Hateley, Brown etc would have downed tools with four games to go and a league title in their grasp?
Laughable!
 
bilkobear said:
I can't be totally sure now but I think Souness intended to keep his departure under wraps and that the players weren't to be told.
But I would need to check that anyway.
However, are you now suggesting that Gough, Hateley, Brown etc would have downed tools with four games to go and a league title in their grasp?
Laughable!
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No, but if you think so highly of the players like that, then Souness wasn’t necessary anyway. (As indeed was proven)
I would always choose a manager who wants to be there ahead of one whose heart is elsewhere.
The only difference is that I don’t have the sense of betrayal that I used to, when somebody does decide they would prefer to be somewhere else.
 
There’s a huge difference between Souness and Gerrard leaving.

Souness wasn’t exactly getting on well with certain folk here, especially the SFA, who clearly wanted to show him who’s boss.

Also as stated earlier he volunteered to stay till the end of the season but Murray told him to go immediately.

He also did a press conference announcing his departure.

Gerrard b*ggered off and left a rather hurried looking instagram message. In a “whoops I’d better say something” kinda way.

Neither of them leaving was nice but at least Souness did it with a modicum of maturity and class compared to Gerrard.

My anger towards Gerrard has mellowed a bit but the way he left was really sh*te.
 
bilkobear said:
No I don't think that was the case.
Murray spat the dummy out.
Everytime I feel any hatred towards the Spivs I always remember that Murray caused the entire fiasco.
He vandalised a decade of our club's history.
A fckn decade!
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I agree with the rest of statement.
 
Graeme Souness talking about, “the manner” of Gerrard leaving there…

There really shouldn’t be much playing down of this.. Gerrard somehow went from hero in May to severely pissing off the great & good of Rangers 6 months later.
 
legalbeagle said:
No, but if you think so highly of the players like that, then Souness wasn’t necessary anyway. (As indeed was proven)
I would always choose a manager who wants to be there ahead of one whose heart is elsewhere.
The only difference is that I don’t have the sense of betrayal that I used to, when somebody does decide they would prefer to be somewhere else.
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Souness and Walter would have got the job done without a stumble.
Instead Murray introduced confusion in the run up that was unnecessary.
No one was betraying anyone in this matter.
That is a 13 year old's hysteria, you should be past that now.
Graeme and Walter are Rangers royalty and Murray is a piece of shyte attached to our history who went on put the club into the greatest peril in its 150 year existence.
 
JMCK said:
He didn't then, because he wanted Walter with him. I'm not really an expert on Souness' time at Rangers, but looking at his career overall I don't think he was a great manager, and I don't Gerrard will be one either. The man we have now is better, as was Walter with Souness.
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Souness was a great manager for Rangers.
The rest of his managerial career was decent if you put it into context alongside the vast majority of football managers who win fckall.
What he did to turn Rangers around at the time was actually phenomenal.
 
I'm So Bored With The MSM said:
Its fairly clear that this thread has many comments from folk who are either forgetting most of the Souness era or were not old enough to have been there at the time and simply heard it second hand from someone who was bitter about him leaving.

Let me just recap for those who either don't remember or weren't there.

In his first game Souness was sent off, fined £5000 and served a three match ban. He got sent of at the piggery in 87' and served a five match ban for telling ref David Syme exactly what he thought of him. In march 89' Souness got banned for the rest of the season after a review of a match at Tannadice in Feb when ref Andrew Waddell added on 5 minutes DU scored in extra time. Playing St Johnstone at the piggery he got his ban extended by a year because the SFA said he defied the ban and they fined him £2000. Souness even though he had effectively retired from playing had picked himself as a sub to get round the ban. Then finally in Feb 90' at Ibrox against Hearts he was filmed in the tunnel and the SFA banned him for another two years and fined him another £5000. So it was a three year touchline ban in total. Much of the above was not included in match reports but revisited via complaint.

Incidentally it wasn't over for Souness because the SFA was going to do him again for running onto the pitch after we beat Celtic in the League Cup Final 90-91' because that was also seen as a transgression of his ban in the eyes of Jim Farry.

Some people I knew were a bit pissed off that Souness left but understood it entirely especially when they new the SFA were as much a part of Souness making that decision as Murray was telling him to go now rather than at the end of the season. Besides most of us who were adults at the time knew that he would leave for Liverpool at some point.
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Compare this with the treatment Lennon got for attacking referees.
 
I don’t have a problem with the timing of Gerrard leaving, just the manner that he left.

It just comes across as ruthless, naive, selfish and lacking in respect.

If he had even did a quick interview or anything other than his cheap social media post I’m sure he would be looked upon differently now.
 
legalbeagle said:
Souness left us with about 4 games to go in a very close league season. Gerrard left before a cup semi.

I remember the Souness departure very well, the bitterness around Gerrard is nowhere near how people felt towards Souness and what he did.

We all mellow with time and Souness is now back to hero status, Gerrard will get the same.
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Souness wanted to stay til the end of the season. Murray told him no he was leaving with immediate effect. Gerrard just bolted.
 
bilkobear said:
Souness and Walter would have got the job done without a stumble.
Instead Murray introduced confusion in the run up that was unnecessary.
No one was betraying anyone in this matter.
That is a 13 year old's hysteria, you should be past that now.
Graeme and Walter are Rangers royalty and Murray is a piece of shyte attached to our history who went on put the club into the greatest peril in its 150 year existence.
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I suspect you also blame Paul Pogba for global warming. You should have grown out of this blind hero worship by now, it’s like a teenage girl lusting after a boyband.
 
Bishybear30 said:
Souness also never left us right before a cup final and having players now openly telling people that the manager wasn’t present at training for a month
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With the greatest of respect, when Souness left, and granted he didn't quite want to leave then, was a million times worse than when Gerrard did it.

I am talking about timing only. I have no bitterness towards either man and thank them for the service they gave our club. Both achieved colossal moments in our history.
 
giffnockloyal said:
That is a lie
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No it isn’t. I was there, the programme cost a fortune and I was about 10 yards from him when he sat in the away bench.

I even recall Brian Laudrup running to take on Jimmy Nicholl who was playing at full back for the ‘old’ team, and Jimmy lifted his hands to his head in a mock ‘panic’ look.
 
Souness also caused us serious problems in the league in 04/05 by taking Boumsoung and then letting them have Bellamy in the same January window. Helicopter Sunday made everybody forget about that.
 
subversive_bear said:
Souness also caused us serious problems in the league in 04/05 by taking Boumsoung and then letting them have Bellamy in the same January window. Helicopter Sunday made everybody forget about that.
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He gave us £8 million for big Boumsong, I don’t think we can hold any aspect of that deal against him, we won out of it big time!!
 
Coda said:
A few of the ex players have spoken about it, albeit one of them was Barry “the mouth” Ferguson.

I mentioned a few weeks ago I’d heard it from a first team player, who by chance I just happened to be in the company of.
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Wtf would Barry know. And “listen” why didn’t he “listen” mention it in his “listen” sun column
 
When Souness joined Rangers we hadn’t won a league in 9 years. He won the league and league cup in his first year

His team won the league cup the following year

He won the league and league cup double the following 2 years before leaving 4 games before the end of the 1990/91 season (which we won another league/league cup double)

When he left, he left to manage the team he’d played for and captained and had most of his success as a player with. I believe he wanted to stay until the end of the season but Sir Moonbeams wanted him to leave and gave Mr Smith the job (eternally grateful for that choice)

After 3 years of Gerrard we’d won one league title (yes it was a big one) then he fucked off to be the manager of a bottom tier EPL team because prestige or some wanky shite (definitely did not leave for the huge increase in salary for him and his team :rolleyes:

Perhaps that might explain why Souness leaving while at the time was a shock has been an easier pill to swallow than the last person to occupy the managers office who’s team slithered off to London to finalize a deal then fucked off with nothing more than an Instagram post like they were dumping some silly wee lassie they’d pumped
 
westenclosurebear said:
That late Motherwell goal that meant we had to win rather than draw.

The passage of time is now kind to Souness, the majority felt betrayed, a small percentage blamed the SFA for running him out of Scottish football.
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100% correct there was alot of bitterness from the supporters, back in '91 with 3 games to go it was a bolt from the blue, a real kick in the teeth, however I believe it didn't come out till later that he wanted to see out the season, he went on the 3rd time of asking, he was at war with sfa as in getting banned from dugout, the stress of it all was making him ill.
 
legalbeagle said:
I suspect you also blame Paul Pogba for global warming. You should have grown out of this blind hero worship by now, it’s like a teenage girl lusting after a boyband.
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I don't know what you are on about.
Since when was seeing Graeme Souness and Walter Smith as heroes as something akin to a fault on this forum?
Are you sure you are on here for the same reasons as the rest of us?
 
bilkobear said:
I don't know what you are on about.
Since when was seeing Graeme Souness and Walter Smith as heroes as something akin to a fault on this forum?
Are you sure you are on here for the same reasons as the rest of us?
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Ok, I’m out. You start by being constantly passive aggressive insulting repeatedly, you then decide to drag Walter Smith’s name into this and finish off by implying something else offensive. I have better things to do in my life than engage with people who act in this manner. Have a good one.
 
legalbeagle said:
Ok, I’m out. You start by being constantly passive aggressive insulting repeatedly, you then decide to drag Walter Smith’s name into this and finish off by implying something else offensive. I have better things to do in my life than engage with people who act in this manner. Have a good one.
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You won't be missed.
 
SGerro8 said:
Wtf would Barry know. And “listen” why didn’t he “listen” mention it in his “listen” sun column
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What do you want me to say? I literally acknowledged he's a mouth.

You've conveniently ignored the part where I said that's not where I heard it.
 
A Hearts fan with Bluenose sympathies left the club for his dream job. The other is a Liverpool fan who left to join another club which would facilitate him better in his ultimate goal of managing his boyhood club.

Neither were dyed in the wool Bluenoses.

Souness definitely became a Rangers man and I dare say Gerrard has become one too, but neither would allow undoubted affections for the club to get in the way of their personal ambitions.

We move on.
 
Had he not stopped 1O-IAR, we would have the knives out good and proper for SG, and possibly deservedly so. But he got us our coveted 55 and for that he has my eternal gratitude.
Had he not won it, would he have been offered the AV job ?
 
BlueSevenTwo said:
I do not remember bitterness toward Souness.
He left for the one club we knew he would.
He also offered to stay and see the season out.
He left a succession plan behind and a very able one at that.
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I remembered some fans being bitter at the time to be fair, if we had lost the league that year it would have been at his door.
It worked out fine in the end obviously as I am sure it will with Gerrard going with eventually even the people still grudging him going moving on and will be well remembered in time by all fans after getting 55.
 
monkey magic said:
Tbf to Souness, the SFA and the media hated him and Rangers for revolutionising the game up here. They've still never forgiven him or us for that. At one time, Souness, Sir Walter, even our reserve coach McGregor, were serving ludicrous long-term touchline bans. It was a vendetta against Rangers.
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100% correct monkey magic ! The vendetta today is a more sinister though and social media is a major tool used in it.
 
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