St Mirren fans unhappy at been moved despite the financial income it brings to the club

In the 80s I remember love St holding near 25000 fans
St boo would have 2/3 of the North Bank and the wee main stand
Us and the scum got the rest of the North Bank, the away end open curve and home end behind the goals
Must have been 18 to 20 thousand away fans, don't remember St boo moaning then
 
Chocolateleftfoot said:
I really don't get what you are saying. Redistribute the wealth in Scottish football? There is no wealth.

Should we pool all our season ticket money and distribute it around clubs that can't fill a stand, never mind a stadium? Like a communist league of sorts? Give them a cut of European prize money? Gate receipts? I really don't know what you are getting at.
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I think you have got it.

If we want to watch competitive football with exciting and unpredictable games we have no choice but to share the limited income more evenly. There is no alternative. Dont forget despite the claim that "you're only here to see the Rangers" you're actually there to watch two teams play.

Of course allowances need to be made for overheads and a reasonable transition phase to let teams adjust.

I also believe we need to introduce a sustainable and affordable salary scale for all players. This would allow the others to keep their best players and build young exciting teams that can genuinely challenge for honours. They'd attract more fans creating better atmospheres. Everyone's a winner.

Note Im NOT talking about a salary cap. Its a salary scale.
 
das said:
What he is saying is that if we want the league to be competitive then yes we would have to as that was when other teams managed to win the league but in part it would also drag us down to their level so makes us less competitive in Europe.
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It must be the most stupid thing I have read on this forum to be honest.

"You know what would make me love Rangers even more? If they took a whole load of the money that the supporters generate and gave it to the clubs that tried to kill us. Sure, we'd have to cut back a bit on players, management, youth development. We'd slide further down the standings in Europe. It would probably hurt revenues as income would probably decrease over time. But at least st Johnstone would beat us more. "
 
Ped78 said:
You said Rangers fans get moved to accommodate the scum,they don’t so you are lying.
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I actually followed it up by using the word "assume" as an explanation but it seems I am wrong.. However, if it makes it feel like any less of a lie to you I will edit my initial post. :D

As I say, overall point still stands on home fans being unhappy having been or in St Mirren's case being asked to move to accommodate an away support.
 
Barryhopez said:
I actually followed it up by using the word "assume" as an explanation but it seems I am wrong.. However, if it makes it feel like any less of a lie to you I will edit my initial post. :D

As I say, overall point still stands on home fans being unhappy having been or in St Mirren's case being asked to move to accommodate an away support.
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Just admit you where wrong and nothing else will be said about it.:shh:
 
Woody83 said:
That’s actually quite pathetic reading and never really realised that since the first ever ball was kicked in Scotland that no real ( third team ) has truly been established.

You do wonder if a team will break the Rangers ( scum ) dynasty in the next 20 years
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To be honest it wouldn’t take all that much to get a team competing in Scotland. Hearts and hibs could do it by getting good Bosmans in and paying decent wages. The problem is the lack of ambition from other clubs and the realisation that you can never make money owning a football team in the spl due to tv revenue so why invest
 
Here's a fact, if everybody local to st mirren and everywhere else in scotland supported their local team, then they would have a bigger support.

Our league is really unhealthy, 2 clubs pulling in over 50,000 and others in the league averaging 4 to 5,000.
 
I’m seem to remember a team (may have been Ajax) donate half of their winnings from European competition to the other teams in the top division in Holland. I wouldn’t be entirely against this idea for all teams competing in Europe, obviously we keep 50% of the winnings and 100% the gate money etc.
 
LOL 133 said:
Dont you get it? They're all classed as "diddy" teams. Same as we are un Europe. Im sure you can figure out why.

Here's a wee clue from a post saying we stopped sharing gate receipts for league games. Apparently this stopped about 40 years ago. The last team to win the league in Scotland outwith the OF did this 36 years ago.
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Yes I do get it, even when it did happened there has only been a few teams that won the top league in Scotland

If we or them had a wage cap both would still win the league as we done it before
 
The St Mirren fans could always just turn up to support their team.

I went to uni there and met heaps of St Mirren “fans”. It was the mid 90s and the conversation usually went along the lines of:
  1. “Hi, I’m RabSpackman and I support Rangers”
  2. “I’m Buddy McBuddy and I support St Mirren - I don’t like Rangers fans, why don’t you support your local team?”
  3. “Well I like less than 5 miles from Ibrox, have a season ticket and go to Ibrox every match”
  4. “I was at Hampden in 1987 to see them win the Cup but I don’t go to matches now”
  5. “I was also at Hampden for that match and come to think of it, I’ve probably seen your team more times than you have”

They would then celebrate us losing Champions League matches in particular as if they had won the game themselves. It was pathetic.
 
TheDerryend said:
Here's a fact, if everybody local to st mirren and everywhere else in scotland supported their local team, then they would have a bigger support.

Our league is really unhealthy, 2 clubs pulling in over 50,000 and others in the league averaging 4 to 5,000.
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The problem is fans of these other teams know their team cant win. Im amazed any of them bother at all.

If we want a genuinely competitive league we have to create a level playing field. That means sharing out the limited income more evenly. There is no alternative.
 
rangeral said:
Yes I do get it, even when it did happened there has only been a few teams that won the top league in Scotland

If we or them had a wage cap both would still win the league as we done it before
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Who mentioned a wage cap? I cant make it any clearer. Its not a wage cap. Its a salary scale and since when have we had a Scottish football wide salary scale coupled with a fair distribution of ALL income?

Your own figures demonstrate clearly that the switch away from gate sharing has created a two horse race. Our league is embarrassing.
 
Mr Blue Sky said:
I’m seem to remember a team (may have been Ajax) donate half of their winnings from European competition to the other teams in the top division in Holland. I wouldn’t be entirely against this idea for all teams competing in Europe, obviously we keep 50% of the winnings and 100% the gate money etc.
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For the super rich leagues CL money isnt that important. In "diddy" leagues like ours it totally distorts and kills competition. If Celtic had qualified most years when we were missing they'd be so far ahead they'd dominate for decades. How is that good?

Id like to see CL money shared with other teams as well as gate receipts, prize money and sponsorships. Most of the money we bring in doesnt benefit Scottish football. It goes right back out on luxury cars, penthouses, designer clothes and diamond rings for "burds".
 
LOL 133 said:
Who mentioned a wage cap? I cant make it any clearer. Its not a wage cap. Its a salary scale and since when have we had a Scottish football wide salary scale coupled with a fair distribution of ALL income?

Your own figures demonstrate clearly that the switch away from gate sharing has created a two horse race. Our league is embarrassing.
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We still a cap on how much we paid players before Souness came in correct? Sure that may go cap in hand with income generated

Yes the list I posted highlights how many teams outwith the 2 major one that have actually won the Scottish League since it started in 1890

Do you believe if League gates were still shared that you still other winners, maybe 1 or 2
 
rangeral said:
We still a cap on how much we paid players before Souness came in correct? Sure that may go cap in hand with income generated

Yes the list I posted highlights how many teams outwith the 2 major one that have actually won the Scottish League since it started in 1890

Do you believe if League gates were still shared that you still other winners, maybe 1 or 2
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I believe Scottish football is only going to get less competitive and therefore less exciting and more predictable as time goes by. As soon as any opposition players show some real potential we buy them or Celtic buy them. Eg Turnbull, Allan, Wright, Jack, Hastie etc, etc. Of course these guys aint going to stay put and turn down the cash. The result is a two horse race.

The only way out of this viscious circle is to share the limited income more evenly AND introduce an affordable and sustainable salary scale (not a cap) for all professional players.
 
Mr Blue Sky said:
I’m seem to remember a team (may have been Ajax) donate half of their winnings from European competition to the other teams in the top division in Holland. I wouldn’t be entirely against this idea for all teams competing in Europe, obviously we keep 50% of the winnings and 100% the gate money etc.
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No fucking way
 
LOL 133 said:
I believe Scottish football is only going to get less competitive and therefore less exciting and more predictable as time goes by. As soon as any opposition players show some real potential we buy them or Celtic buy them. Eg Turnbull, Allan, Wright, Jack, Hastie etc, etc. Of course these guys aint going to stay put and turn down the cash. The result is a two horse race.

The only way out of this viscious circle is to share the limited income more evenly AND introduce an affordable and sustainable salary scale (not a cap) for all professional players.
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Yeah I agreed with you that while it is good that both are keeping some players within Scotland it can also be harmful as it is weakening those teams and in turn fans of those clubs aren't attending fair play to those that do
 
"Just think; waking up to start a new life in the Glasgow of 2068. The ring road will be finished! Partick Thistle in the European Cup! The SDA will have started a facelift in Bearsden - trees everywhere! And medicine - just think of the progress. Everybody in Paisley will be able to have a brain transplant."

That Sinking Feeling (1979)
 
LOL 133 said:
Who mentioned a wage cap? I cant make it any clearer. Its not a wage cap. Its a salary scale and since when have we had a Scottish football wide salary scale coupled with a fair distribution of ALL income?

Your own figures demonstrate clearly that the switch away from gate sharing has created a two horse race. Our league is embarrassing.
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Maybe we could go back to Jim McClean and his Victorian ethic of tying young players on 9 year contracts where he also fined players so often that come payday they owed the club money.
Split our gate money and the likes of Port Vale would be poaching any talent to come through our ranks before they had tied their boot laces for their debut.
For Rangers to meet the fans ambitions we need more money and lots of it and it isn't our fault that Hibs,Aberdeen and St Johnstone can't show a bit of ambition and qualify for the conference league in Europe where the financial rewards for them would be massive
Football is stale here but that's as much to do with the tactics and we even had a team who lined up 1-5-5 at Ibrox last season and sharing all the money in the world wouldn't change that as they would just have more to lose
My brother is a St Mirren fan and he often said he preferred being in the first division due to the competitive nature of maybe 5/6 teams competing so i understand your sentiments for a better product but our ambitions lie up the way with more prolonged European leagues.
2012 showed us all how much the rest of Scottish football cared for a strong Rangers to the extent of severely damaging their own finances and which the game here has still not truly recovered from but it was their own greed and the filth lies that led them there.
We still pack out their grounds but they deserve no more
 
LOL 133 said:
I believe Scottish football is only going to get less competitive and therefore less exciting and more predictable as time goes by. As soon as any opposition players show some real potential we buy them or Celtic buy them. Eg Turnbull, Allan, Wright, Jack, Hastie etc, etc. Of course these guys aint going to stay put and turn down the cash. The result is a two horse race.

The only way out of this viscious circle is to share the limited income more evenly AND introduce an affordable and sustainable salary scale (not a cap) for all professional players.
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Agree with some of what you are saying but redistribution of money within Scotland would have the effect of making us even less competitive in Europe. Until other countries are similarly handicapped by limiting spending, and stopping the super rich clubs stock-piling players at all levels, then I don't want to see Rangers handicapped in this way.
 
You say we need more money but most of it goes on crazy wages to players so its like filling a bath with the plug out. Not only that bit it kills the opposition.
 
stonewall Jackson said:
The Arrogance of the diddy clubs never ceases to amaze me. A philosophy built on a foundation of sand. Many of these clubs will go to the wall in the next couple of years.
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To be fair most of these teams are reasonably OK financially, no incentive to spend crazy amounts as they know they can't compete with the OF.
 
RangersForever said:
Agree with some of what you are saying but redistribution of money within Scotland would have the effect of making us even less competitive in Europe. Until other countries are similarly handicapped by limiting spending, and stopping the super rich clubs stock-piling players at all levels, then I don't want to see Rangers handicapped in this way.
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I hear you but I dont see Europe as a realistic option for us anyway. We're just cannon fodder. A "diddy" team if you like.

Our bread and butter is Scotland and we could lead the way in making real changes. We could easily take every team bar Celtic with us and we might even put them in a very precarious position if we do. We could also alienate them politically and win over those that tried to kill us off.

There's a review going on just now with 5 of our biggest clubs looking for ways to improve the game. We could chip in with this new approach leaving Celtic out in the cold.
 
Like some others have said, I wouldn’t be against something like a small 5% of European earnings from every club going into a pot. Not to ‘share the wealth’ as such but maybe use it for grants. If you have a grass pitch you get 50k a year to help maintain it. Use it to implement things that benefit everyone like full time refs or goal line tech, rather than just direct money to others clubs.

Right now there wouldn’t be too much in it but if we started getting a guaranteed 40m CL spot, the second team done okay in Europe and brought in say 15-20m then the third and fourth teams actually qualified for the conference and brought in a few mil each, that could be 5m a season to improve the infrastructure of the league, which hopefully then brings better sponsors, then better TV coverage, then better players willing to come etc.
 
Chocolateleftfoot said:
It must be the most stupid thing I have read on this forum to be honest.

"You know what would make me love Rangers even more? If they took a whole load of the money that the supporters generate and gave it to the clubs that tried to kill us. Sure, we'd have to cut back a bit on players, management, youth development. We'd slide further down the standings in Europe. It would probably hurt revenues as income would probably decrease over time. But at least st Johnstone would beat us more. "
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So you prefer the current set up with the OF steamrollering all others and winning over 105 titles between them? Our league is a laughing stock. No one is interested in it.
 
TBF reading that it says the ST holders need to pay a tenner to move seat, and if they don't by the deadline will be skinned £27. Think that's more what the issue will be about.
 
NE Cornerbear said:
Hammarby. I know a couple of St Boooooo fans and one mention of the H word has them clamped!
I was actually at the game, my bro lived in Paisley at the time (early 80s). The Norwegian team bumped them out the UEfa cup in injury time.
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they were Swedish,


St Mirren put us out the cup last year in injury time !
 
Ferrybear73 said:
Another example of Scottish football hating itself to death. St Boo fans are mental.
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To be honest I wouldn’t be happy having to move from my season ticket to accommodate away fans.

There will be 3,000 tops more there than they usually get, this will be offset by having to have additional Police and Stewards. It’s hardly worth it for the backlash of the fans. I also know St Mirren season tickets holders who don’t go to games v us or the scum because of this.

Its also a crazy idea having us at both ends of the ground with both sets of fans having to mix to get in and out.
 
Angrybluebear said:
To be honest I wouldn’t be happy having to move from my season ticket to accommodate away fans.

There will be 3,000 tops more there than they usually get, this will be offset by having to have additional Police and Stewards. It’s hardly worth it for the backlash of the fans. I also know St Mirren season tickets holders who don’t go to games v us or the scum because of this.

Its also a crazy idea having us at both ends of the ground with both sets of fans having to mix to get in and out.
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This shouldn’t be a problem. It’s been done for years with no issues at places like Rugby Park, and others.

The St Mirren chairman has already said its financially worth it so the extra overheads must be minimal compared with the extra income.
 
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