The Club In Process of Banning Fans For “Offensive Banner”

ronaldieu

Member
Official Ticketer
Certainly not. Because the context within the songs are offensive. The word fenian is a legitimate word to describe an Irish settler. If they had the flag in the stadium then fair enough, they can't do that, and it would harm the club. But outside.. the boys can do or say what they like. If they said %^*& the Irish on it would anyone care? Fenian is a fair way to describe most of their fans literally, wouldn't you agree?
I'm not advocating offensive singing btw I'm just thinking of the word fenian being used that's it. I'm a up for binning the FTP/IRA shit3
yeah to be fair i feel exactly the same. the word's meaning seems to have been lost/warped recently but it frustrates the life out of me when fellow fans feel this somehow gives them the right to continue singing it. as unjust as it is we have to play by UEFA's rules whether we like it or not.
 

Cutty/Young

Well-Known Member
I think the club are being a tad heavy handed here.

After the partial stadium closure I thought that they had engaged with fans groups and "influencers" regarding what songs and specific words were acceptable.

I thought there was a consensus on here that it was UEFA's tournement and that we needed to keep certain songs and chants for supporters buses and "sash bashes" etc.

To me, that would suggest that not many of us actually agree with UEFA's interpretation of "the f word" but that we should box clever.

Now clearly photographing this flag isn't boxing clever but I would suggest the club are moving the goalposts here.

I do get that a zero tolerance approach from the club does send a powerful message to the support as a whole but these guys, whilst being stupid, are a bit unlucky.

Are we now saying that there are certain songs and words that have no place anywhere?

Because that's a different position and one that I find troubling and perhaps even slightly hypocritical.
What people choose to do in their private lifes is up to them, the club know they have no control over this nor would it be any of the club's business, what the club are saying is they would rather these songs and banners weren't heard or held up when people were officially representing the club home or away as it damages the image of the club and support, not difficult to understand especially given strict liability is enforced and the club are punished as are the supporters if the club refuse to take tickets.

If people loved the club the way they claim they do, they would do nothing to harm the club and you always protect something you love, but there is an element in our support despite knowing the club will get punished or at worse the whole stadium closed, choose to rebel against the club's wishes to the extent of not giving a toss what punishment the club gets.

The same ones who would be calling UEFA all the bastards under the sun if we had a stadium closure.

I find it absolutely astonishing that despite the club asking for all this to stop, there are those who ignore it and willing to take the chance of the club being punished severely, does that sound like people who claim to love their club ?
 

TimzRFudz

Well-Known Member
Too much trying to stick tonone side of an arguement here.

Were they stupid? Undoubtedly.

Is it wrong in the context of Rangers? Yes.

Was it in the stadium? No.

That's where I've got dubiety with this. What if they are season ticket holders but travelled ticketless and didnt get into the de kuip? How do you legislate for happenings outside re banners etc? Anyone could use anything anywhere if it could harm the club.

It's a wee but concerningnif the club become the opinion police. For example, you're on the next euro away trip, and on film you are caught saying something stupid? Should you be banned for your opinion in a pub?

I think people need to consider where it was, as well as what it was.
I get your over-riding point about where do we draw the line in terms of what we can reasonably expect the club to get involved with.

However, there's quite a wide difference between standing grinning like a fanny with a big massive banner you've gone out and had made to "get it up" someone.... and someone recording a private conversation on a phone or something like that in a pub mate.

Bottom line is - as others have pointed out - it's entirely up to Rangers who they let into the stadium or don't. Bringing the club's name into disrepute via a deliberate action at a time when we're fighting on a range of fronts is arrogant, reckless, stupid and the club is entitled to deal with them as they see fit. If the punters facing a ban don't like it or think it's harsh, get lawyered up and see how far that gets them...
 

Godrup99

Well-Known Member
They are probably being pro-active and ensuring that they don't take it into the next game. If they have no intention of taking it into grounds, then why did they get it made?
And do you know what, I'd probably go with a bring them in and make it clear what is and iant acceptable and what must never happen again. I'd be concerned we are banning folk for stupidity when they weren't at the environs of a stadium or party to UEFA rules and expectations. If they weren't part of an official party or present at the match with it, I'd have problems with severe action being dished out.
 

supersonic

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
Grade A Fucking knobends? As much as I wouldn't get that type of banner made up to take to the fitba the vast majority of The Rangers support agree with the sentiment. %^*& them. They are fenain bastards. We do hate them. The banner was nowhere near the game, take a day off of being self righteous. Thank %^*& you weren't on the bus sooking the fun out of it.
Grown men need to be allowed to sing about the pope, fenians and other irreverent shite to have "fun". Get a grip mate. Your "fun" and attitude towards us damages the reputation of the club, fans, our sponsors, our (essentially your) club money and european competition. But carry on, dont want to spoil your fun pal.
 

Steve Snedden

Well-Known Member
Dearie me. Seriously?
Yes, seriously.

I'm simply trying to establish if we're boxing clever or if we're now saying that these things that we all did in the past are now morally wrong, because there is a world of difference.

I've already stated that the young lads were stupid. I'm not a member of the "I'll sing what I want brigade", I'm trying to establish the exact rules in this new reality.
 

supersonic

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
The self-same custodians who approved the release of an orange 3rd kit which is clearly a nod to our historical links to the Protestant, Unionist and Loyalist communities?
Can still release an orange kit without having to shag the word fenian and the pope.
Yes, seriously.

I'm simply trying to establish if we're boxing clever or if we're now saying that these things that we all did in the past are now morally wrong, because there is a world of difference.

I've already stated that the young lads were stupid. I'm not a member of the "I'll sing what I want brigade", I'm trying to establish the exact rules in this new reality.
The new rules of reality are if you behave in a way that causes the club trouble, bother or tarnished the reputation of the club you can get banned. Rather straight forward.
 

Goldenboot

Well-Known Member
yeah to be fair i feel exactly the same. the word's meaning seems to have been lost/warped recently but it frustrates the life out of me when fellow fans feel this somehow gives them the right to continue singing it. as unjust as it is we have to play by UEFA's rules whether we like it or not.
I agree 100% with u on using it within our songs. It can't be sung in this day and age. But my point was, these boys getting banned for a banner that they were not even in the stadium with, is all about weird considering the word fenian is a legitimate term for describing their fans. For example, up to our knees in fenian blood for me is a bit outrageous in this day in age, but the blue flag... will be mastered by no fenian bastard, is totally legitimate for me. It's not about religion or a terrorist group/political group. It's a term used to describe their fans literally.
 

Godrup99

Well-Known Member
I get your over-riding point about where do we draw the line in terms of what we can reasonably expect the club to get involved with.

However, there's quite a wide difference between standing grinning like a fanny with a big massive banner you've gone out and had made to "get it up" someone.... and someone recording a private conversation on a phone or something like that in a pub mate.

Bottom line is - as others have pointed out - it's entirely up to Rangers who they let into the stadium or don't. Bringing the club's name into disrepute via a deliberate action at a time when we're fighting on a range of fronts is arrogant, reckless, stupid and the club is entitled to deal with them as they see fit. If the punters facing a ban don't like it or think it's harsh, get lawyered up and see how far that gets them...
Knowing how ineffective Rangers seems to be in certain areas I'd imagine Rangers would probably lose.

I get your point also, it's the where and when that if it went legal would potentially scupper Rangers. How much do Rangers want to control the people who travel unofficially. Near the stadium? in the same city? A different city? Anywhere in that country or on the way there? Not comparing to the scum and they can do what the %^*& they like. I've seen some vile stuff from them at away trips, however if not actually at the game or with rhe official travel group, what realistically are the powers that say were banning you. If the banner was in scotland Id expect a police response but I'm just not comfortable of action being taken due to stupid individual actions in a random place in a foreign country.
 

Bowery Boy

Well-Known Member
Yes, seriously.

I'm simply trying to establish if we're boxing clever or if we're now saying that these things that we all did in the past are now morally wrong, because there is a world of difference.

I've already stated that the young lads were stupid. I'm not a member of the "I'll sing what I want brigade", I'm trying to establish the exact rules in this new reality.
It just seems like needlessly muddying the waters mate. There is a clear world of difference between the club releasing an orange kit and endorsing a banner with that phrase on it. They have been very clear on the behaviour that they won't be tolerating. UEFA have never punished us for links to Unionism or Protestantism. The issue is with fcuking the Pope and being up to the knees in Fenian blood. Whether we like it or not, surely we all know this now?
 

Moreloslaces

Well-Known Member
It's not right that the club cower in fear to the republican propaganda machine. If the tim board banned a few tims for an airport "%^*& the H.." banner.We'd think they were all under the thumb well and truly.They wouldn't do that even though they've had fines aswell.

If the board want to slowly criminalise any display of Protestantism and unionism within Ibrox. They are going to have issues. Maybe if you get snapped at an orange walk playing BB.You'll get a ban aswell. Banning fans for airport behaviour is beyond belief. Dividing the club from it's core support base( working class prods) isn't going to work out well in the long run.
Putting fenian bastards on a flag is not a display of unionism or protestantism. Its a display of utter stupidity.
 

ronaldieu

Member
Official Ticketer
I agree 100% with u on using it within our songs. It can't be sung in this day and age. But my point was, these boys getting banned for a banner that they were not even in the stadium with, is all about weird considering the word fenian is a legitimate term for describing their fans. For example, up to our knees in fenian blood for me is a bit outrageous in this day in age, but the blue flag... will be mastered by no fenian bastard, is totally legitimate for me. It's not about religion or a terrorist group/political group. It's a term used to describe their fans literally.
again i think most people will agree with you on that one but rangers have to be seen to distance themselves entirely from anything deemed to be sectarian (rightly or wrongly). unfortunately, as frustrating as it is, that's just the world we live in these days.
 

Captain Cutlass

Well-Known Member
Official Ticketer
Just a thought.
Do ANY of the folk on here claiming that letting off pyro and singing about fenians and f*cking the pope have any real concerns when the possibility of having a whole stadium closure for the Young Boys game was considered to be a genuine possibility?
If they didn't then they're idiots!
If they did then they're even bigger idiots!
 

ICA_86

Well-Known Member
Nothing wrong with it if it's not in the stadium. Surely the club can't ban them for posing outwith a match situation? The boys were actually on my bus from Rotterdam to Feyenoord and were brand new. The abuse is a bit harsh
Bizarre approach to take on it.

The club cannot take any risks with this, if these morons are happy to have their photos taken with the flag - in, even more embarrassingly, a fucking airport - for social media then there’s nothing that makes me think they wouldn’t pull it out during a game.

The club’s totally correct in what it’s doing and if you think otherwise you simply cannot have the best interests of Rangers at heart.
 

Texas ranger

Well-Known Member
There might be a bigger picture at play here too.

The club are in the business of making the business of Rangers a more attractive proposition too, not just winning games and trophies.We will always need investors in the club, not just the ones that buy shares. The corporate sponsors, the folks that associate their company with Rangers and pay to do so, fans, in fact anybody that spends money on Rangers or who could potentially spend money with Rangers. Some would say deeper than that, to those that can show the brand in a good or bad light. That’s a whole separate discussion so I’ll not go there.

Maybe they are turning a corner here with brand protection and not just because UEFA are breathing down our necks but also because it is a way to attract more sponsors as well. How do you grow your brand when it’s getting plastered over the internet, tv, newspapers with bad publicity ? You take action to stop it. I don’t know about the legal rights and wrongs, freedom of speech versus brand defamation, etc, etc. We do know that UEFA have jurisdiction in, and apparently around stadiums for their ties. Where does Rangers control over their brand extend too ?
 
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Capo

Well-Known Member
Absolutely embarrassing and not what we need. The club is doing a lot of great things to drag the club in to the 21st Century and then we have utter morons dragging our name through the mud again. Anybody defending this is any way shape or form is quite frankly a tit and a knuckle dragger. People need to get with the times or get left behind.
 

punksnotdead

Well-Known Member
Theory goes If we get our house in order and the tims still play up then we'll be able to hammer them and turn the tables with improved press.The moral high ground strategy. Anyone who's got experience of NI and the media over there would understand it's not going to pan out like that.

What will happen as in NI. We'll cut our culture to the bone over the next few years but every time our fans step a tiny bit out of line we'll still get hammered as the problem while the tims will run wild as usual and the media will give them a pass regardless of the facts and how much ground we've given up.

It's road to nowhere strategy..across the water and here. It's very similar in terms of a one sided sectarianism process and where that leads.
It was a crazy banner to get made up and they were asking for trouble by doing so. I would much rather spend my hard earned on a Rangers banner with no mention of the other mob.

In saying that I can't help thinking back to the hanging effigies and "know your place hun scum" banner that the groin brigade displayed a while back. Can anybody tell me how many were banned by the tarriers for that wee escapade, genuine question.

I agree totally with your point op. They will whittle us away to sitting on our hands at the game while they carry on unabated. Anybody thinking we'll gain the moral high ground and be able to point the finger at them must also believe in fairies.
 

Midfield General

Well-Known Member
Not going to lie, i didn't really see much wrong with the banner. Seen alot worse. The mhedia in this country have done their job again.
The Club and the governing authorities have a different view,whether you like it or not banners like this and songs with add one need to stop or the Club and fans will suffer for it.
 

MrStruth

Well-Known Member
Sadly Dave King did not CHALLENGE the term and so it now stands (as far as the football governing body is concerned) as being racist even though it is nothing of the sort.
 

RFC4ME

Well-Known Member
Not going to lie, i didn't really see much wrong with the banner. Seen alot worse. The mhedia in this country have done their job again.

It's gone past the point you get to decide your view on that word though....

This will piss and irk folks but there is most likely some in deep south America who still don't see the issue in some words either, it doesn't mean they get to say them anymore...

Folks really need to let this one go and move on from it.
 

tumsheeheed

Well-Known Member
Why put Celtic on a Rangers flag something I for one would never do bit like getting a F#ck Celtic tattoo maybe those young lads have got some wouldn’t surprise me
 

Gogso

Well-Known Member
I think it’s harsh if they are going to ban people for the pyro ,

This isn’t just Rangers but all over the country club will ban people for pyro and flares etc until the club win and then they use these images as promotion , either the clubs are completed against it or they can try and promote the safe use of pyro ( likely never happen I know )
Seriously?
Does your mother know you have internet access?
 

Marc

Active Member
Official Ticketer
Playing complete devils advocate here, they didn’t display it in the stadium, how can the club then ban them? It was displayed in a public space? For the record the banner is idiotic and those that produced it clearly cannot see where the club is trying to go.
Club can ban anyone for anything they choose theoretically.
 

SasaPapacLoyal54

Well-Known Member
Theory goes If we get our house in order and the tims still play up then we'll be able to hammer them and turn the tables with improved press.The moral high ground strategy. Anyone who's got experience of NI and the media over there would understand it's not going to pan out like that.

What will happen as in NI. We'll cut our culture to the bone over the next few years but every time our fans step a tiny bit out of line we'll still get hammered as the problem while the tims will run wild as usual and the media will give them a pass regardless of the facts and how much ground we've given up.

It's road to nowhere strategy..across the water and here. It's very similar in terms of a one sided sectarianism process and where that leads.
You are moving into a different argument there.

While I agree that the sectarian industry is one sided against us, the way to fight it isn't by Shouting about fenians or the Pope at Rangers games. That's just playing into our enemies hands.

As for Northern Ireland, just listen to the songs that the GAWA sing. They don't sing about the Pope and fenians and they are a better support for it. In fact I would say that they are the best international support in Europe and I would bet the majority of them are bears.

If they can give up the uber prod stuff at the football then why can't us Scottish folk do it?
 

cuellarsbraces

Well-Known Member
Grade A Fucking knobends? As much as I wouldn't get that type of banner made up to take to the fitba the vast majority of The Rangers support agree with the sentiment. %^*& them. They are fenain bastards. We do hate them. The banner was nowhere near the game, take a day off of being self righteous. Thank %^*& you weren't on the bus sooking the fun out of it.
It’s not about being self-righteous though. It’s about the inability of some elements in the support that cannot get by this fucking nonsense and the reputation all damage it does to everyone.

Have a laugh on the bus aye. In public all over social media I mean FFS - have a day off as you say.
 

BlueLagoonCo

Well-Known Member
Are people opinions on here being plastered across the press and social media alongside the clubs badge? No they aren’t.
Do you know these people or something? You seem very keen to defend the indefensible. It defies belief that after all the hassle the club have had and after a personal plea from our manger, that anybody could be so stupid as to get that flag that flag made, then stand like idiots posing for photos with it.
Im not defending anything i just find some of the comments against their own out of order
 

Gogso

Well-Known Member
Tend to agree with him tbh, I might be wrong but the picture wasn’t at the game it was at the airport. Was it daft or course it was but let’s be honest here if it was put up in a bar in Amsterdam no one would have said anything about it.
It wasn't. it was in full public view and invited whoever to see it and spread the photos far and wide.
To give the haters of our club & community another chance to castigate us all. FFS
 

bucks72

Active Member
It's a very crude banner but of course it's a symbol of unionism and Protestantism in terms of intent and meaning even though most people over 25 in the PUL community would see it as a bit of a riddy. But the slow criminalization of Unionism at Ibrox isn't so much referring to the banner but the current feeling from the board to anything of that bent. It's the wider context.

It's clear where this is all headed even if it's 3 or 4 years down the line. The direction of travel. Any symbolism of unionism and Protestantism is just to embarrassing to middle class liberals in our support. They don't like any of it. They aren't being honest with the support though that they want to do away with everything. Instead they are using Uefa fines are a trojan horse and trying to do it bit by bit.
You are missing the point here.
The rules are there in black and white - if some of our "fans" (I use that term loosely and not "supporters" in this case) continue to behave in the way they are then we will be playing in an empty stadium.
I would say 99% of our fans at sometime in the past have sung songs THAT ARE NOW BANNED. Times have changed and we must move on.
Its nothing to do with Rangers FC and anti-Protestantism or anti-unionism. Its nothing to do with the media, its nothing to do with C**t*c.
It is up to Rangers to stamp it out. It is up to the real supporters to stop it and point it out.
You will not like what I have to say but as a fan base we need to look in the mirror and take responsibility. Forget the whataboutery and get our own house in order.
We must make sure OUR CLUB that we have fought to save are not punished any further.
To claim ignorance and continue with what is going on is madness with a predictable outcome.
 

TimzRFudz

Well-Known Member
Knowing how ineffective Rangers seems to be in certain areas I'd imagine Rangers would probably lose.

I get your point also, it's the where and when that if it went legal would potentially scupper Rangers. How much do Rangers want to control the people who travel unofficially. Near the stadium? in the same city? A different city? Anywhere in that country or on the way there? Not comparing to the scum and they can do what the %^*& they like. I've seen some vile stuff from them at away trips, however if not actually at the game or with rhe official travel group, what realistically are the powers that say were banning you. If the banner was in scotland Id expect a police response but I'm just not comfortable of action being taken due to stupid individual actions in a random place in a foreign country.
I think we're actually on the same page mate - but I think ultimately it comes down to the club not needing any powers as such. It's their stadium. They're not obliged to let anyone in they don't want in.

If they deem - rightly or wrongly - that someone is bringing their name into disrepute then it's Ranger's right to refuse them entry. When they get it wrong - and they may well do - then I think that's a different debate and where the fans groups, supporters buses and SLO etc all need to get around the table with them.

But... I think in this case most progressively-minded supporters who want the club to thrive and be able to concentrate solely on football matters won't lose any sleep over these dafties copping a ban.

(FWIW - I think there's an opportunity for the club to maybe do a bit more here... for example, make it a ban for the remainder of this season and all of next. Invite the lads to come and get involved with some of the community initiatives the club runs. Have a chat with club representatives to discuss how we can't have shite like this continually dragging us down. And only then - if the guys engage - reverse their ban for the 21/22 season. Leave the door open to allow people to learn their lesson. Just a thought...)
 
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