Ryan Kent- has to stay

He also played a big part in 2 goals and should've had 2 assists yesterday, but for poor finishing by our CFs.

We've also won all league games, bar the draw with the filth since Beale arrived, and Kent's played in all of them, I think?

Kent is not our problem, as much as some posters want to slaughter every one of our players.
Partick at home Kent never started and we really struggled to create before he came on it’s been pretty much the same in the few games he’s missed since signing.

But the great football brains of FF tell us he’s a problem and needs to go.
 
There’s always going to be this back and forth with Kent because, simply put, his numbers should be better. So then it comes down to how much you value the rest of the work he does.

On the other end of the spectrum we have someone like Sakala whose numbers are very good but in my opinion is not good enough to be starting consistently.

The one area I feel a bit sorry for Kent is that we have a team full of players who miss chance after chance. In the last few weeks (not including yesterday) he’s created 4 or 5 chances that were genuine sitters for Colak/Sakala etc. and all were fücked up by the striker. If people were scoring the chances that he’s been putting on a plate, his assist numbers would be looking a lot better.

I’d love to see a deep dive from some stato on the quality of chances created compared to chances converted for him.
 
If this chancer is given a contract extension then we’ll reap what we sow. Standby for more shoulder shuffle/double stepover and mediocrity.
A forward player for Rangers should be returning 12-15 goals across all competitions as a minimum. He’s playing in Scotland ffs.
Laudrup managed that once in his 4 seasons. Calling kent a ‘chancer’ is diabolical patter
 
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He's been excellent the last 4 games, which shows how stats can mislead.
He's laid at least one sitter on a plate per game for others, who've missed them.
Stats don't show that, but Beale recognizes his contribution.
Exactly stats aren't the end all be all.

Remember the Defoe dummy? Was it against them? He will get 0 official credit for that but he was integral to the goal we scored. Stats wise Defoe done nothing, but without Defoe that wasn't a goal.

Kent should score more goals but sometimes stats dont' show the whole picture
 
It's a horrible comparison to make, but I stand by it. I loved us playing against McGeady, because the visuals were so hilariously jarring with the actual result of the trickery. McGeady was a dead end, so is Kent.
Look, for all of these players we employ hyperbole. Was McGeady crap? Of course not, he was a solid pro, but he just wasn't exceptional in anything other than having a style that was exciting to watch (for the impartially inclined or them). His highlight reel will look great, but it didn't amount to much, and we beat them more often than not.
All pros will do something spectacular at some point. Ralph Milne scored a wonder goal against Celtc. Owen Archdeacon had a moment of wonder against us when he had an intercept and goal any pro would regard as top drawer. But let's agree on this - Archdeacon, charitably, wasn't very good. At all.
I hope Beale has ambitions considerably higher than Ryan Kent. I think there's better value out there and certainly there are wingers who despite being less pleasing on the eye will contribute far more in the way of goals and assists.

The most horrific of all conclusions: If you anonymise the players names and simply choose players based on their contributions - goals, assists, goals per shot, per game etc you wouldn't just pick Jota over Kent. You'd pick Abada over Kent, you'd pick Haksabanovic over Kent and you'd pick the unrated Maeda over Kent. Why? Because every Celtc winger is contributing more to the team than Kent is contributing to ours. It's not that their main winger is producing more, but their second choice produces more, and more embarrassingly - their THIRD choice player in that position is contributing more. It's one of the reasons we're finishing second, and we have to address it.
Frankly the comparison with the dark side players is a gross exaggeration of Kent’s weaknesses.
Haksabanovic Abada really.
Firstly I do agree that in terms of goals and direct assists we are looking for more as the bare stats are poor.
However Kent is integral to the style of football we are playing under MB.
His workrate speed and ability to link up with the midfield and Borna are crucial.
I would suggest his actual involvement in goals at some point in the move will be far greater than the actual recorded stats.
If there is one player in our team that they would want us to get rid of it’s Kent I would guess.
In European football the one player which really concerns the opposition is Kent.

Imo he would be extremely hard to replace for what he gives to the team.
 
Twice. 13 in 94/95 and 20 in 96/97

His record was just under 1 goal every three games.
So he managed it twice, once only just. Laudrup is our best ever and even then, playing out wide, 15-20 a season is unlikely. Its the nature of the position. Not getting it certainly doesn’t make the player a chancer as that poster suggested
 
So he managed it twice, once only just. Laudrup is our best ever and even then, playing out wide, 15-20 a season is unlikely. Its the nature of the position. Not getting it certainly doesn’t make the player a chancer as that poster suggested

Football has changed. The expectation is that your wide forwards need to be chipping in with minimum double figures in both goals and assists.

Look at the Arsenal game right now as an example. Any team playing 3 forwards, the central player is used to occupy the centre backs (and obviously chip in with share of goals), but the wide players absolutely must be a significant goal threat. Ours have been lacking for years.

I find it ironic that Candeias was criticised by Gerrard for his lack of numbers, yet Kent has never significantly produced better numbers on a consistent basis.
 
Comparing his goals/assists per 90 to Sakala, Abada, Jota and Maeda across their Scottish Premiership careers


A couple of things are clear:

Sakala is a far more effective player than he's given credit for, having the highest goals+assists per 90 among that group.

Kent is in last place in both categories. The argument that he makes up in assists what he lacks in goals doesn't hold. Kent averages an assist every 4 full games, Sakala who is more of a finisher than a creator still manages to average an assist every 3 full games.
 
Comparing his goals/assists per 90 to Sakala, Abada, Jota and Maeda across their Scottish Premiership careers


A couple of things are clear:

Sakala is a far more effective player than he's given credit for, having the highest goals+assists per 90 among that group.

Kent is in last place in both categories. The argument that he makes up in assists what he lacks in goals doesn't hold. Kent averages an assist every 4 full games, Sakala who is more of a finisher than a creator still manages to average an assist every 3 full games.

The problem with assists is it’s a two-person stat. To have assists you need to have someone who can convert chances, and we’re one of the worst around for converting chances.

Is there any way to get chance creation stats? Curious to see how those would look
 
The problem with assists is it’s a two-person stat. To have assists you need to have someone who can convert chances, and we’re one of the worst around for converting chances.

Is there any way to get chance creation stats? Curious to see how those would look

Unfortunately fbref don't provide full coverage for Scotland. Glancing at SofaScore, they have credited Kent with 9 so-called "big chances created" in 2241 minutes this season (0.36 per 90). For comparison, Sakala has 7 big chances created in 1215 minutes (0.52 per 90), Jota has 11 in 1687 minutes (0.58 per 90), Abada has 9 in 1247 minutes (0.64 per 90). Malik Tillman has 10 in 1615 minutes (0.55 per 90).
 
One thing you get from Kent whether he playing poorly or not is work rate and tracking back maybe like a few players he's been here too long and he's easier to combat now.

As I said from week to week I change my mind on Kent staying or going.
 
Re read your posts ffs, your tone towards Beale is toxic.

We've gone from getting a couple of hidings under Gio to outplaying them at Ibrox, and losing a final that could've gone either way.

You're talking shite.
Did we win either ?
No thought not and until we do we’ll be second best.

Remember that Gio beat them in a SF on the way to winning the SC.
 
Comparing his goals/assists per 90 to Sakala, Abada, Jota and Maeda across their Scottish Premiership careers


A couple of things are clear:

Sakala is a far more effective player than he's given credit for, having the highest goals+assists per 90 among that group.

Kent is in last place in both categories. The argument that he makes up in assists what he lacks in goals doesn't hold. Kent averages an assist every 4 full games, Sakala who is more of a finisher than a creator still manages to average an assist every 3 full games.
Assist stats are tricky though. In the last few games alone kent has put one on a plate for Sakala twice, alfie and colak and all have missed. He doesn’t get the assist but did everything spot on. Its a harsh metric as it relies on the ability of others.
 
Love Kent, want him to stay. However he needs to work on his shooting as it’s holding him back. If I was his manager I’d have him on practice shooting drills everyday working on his finishing. Once he cracks it, then he will do the job for us.
 
I call it as I see it but if people like you continue to lap up second rate performances and continue to berate fellow posters who question them then we will never get anywhere.
Where does berating players on social media get us? Think you need to realise anything wrote on here matters not a jot.
 
Where does berating players on social media get us? Think you need to realise anything wrote on here matters not a jot.
So in your world lets pretend everything in the garden is rosy and accept highly paid professionals go through the motions and sully the name of our great club - sorry I’m out.
 
So in your world lets pretend everything in the garden is rosy and accept highly paid professionals go through the motions and sully the name of our great club - sorry I’m out.
I’ve never once said everything in the gardens rosy - calling Kent an imposter is beyond stupid tho.

Morelos Kent & Tav get more abuse than anyone on this forum yet they get massive support from supporters at the games - so forgive me for not listening to guys like yourself negative spin on certain players.
 
I’ve never once said everything in the gardens rosy - calling Kent an imposter is beyond stupid tho.

Morelos Kent & Tav get more abuse than anyone on this forum yet they get massive support from supporters at the games - so forgive me for not listening to guys like yourself negative spin on certain players.
Kent has been been non existent for months and is hyped beyond belief.
Morelos is clearly going through the motions and is a disgrace as a professional footballer.
Both have had their day at Ibrox and that wasn’t yesterday.
 
From who though ?

One club apart, no one has came near Kent in 4 years.

If we re-sign him then he'll be here for the entire contract. I just don't see any team giving us the money we'd want.
LIkely not big money, but we would at least be in a position to recoup some.
Like I said, it would all depend on how much he was asking for. I would only offer reduced terms, which he likely wont take, but wont get what he is on here anywhere else.
 
He’s absolutely rank rotten man.

His numbers are appalling for a Rangers winger, given the amount of the ball we have.

There were centre halfs from bottom half teams that outscored him last year.

No doubt we’ll cave and give him 40k a week, and continue to stagnate as a club.
 
Imagine making up a lie about Brian Laudrup to defend Kent.

You’ve got an incredibly weird attachment to players who’ve brought Rangers very little success.
I corrected it to twice in 4 season. One of those met the parameters given by the poster by 1 goal. It would seem that the difference between our greatest ever winger and a guy called a ‘chancer’ is a very small margin in terms of stats. Hence the problem with stats.

You must be the most negative guy on here. It genuinely must be a chore supporting us with your outlook.
 
These debates thread after thread are tedious. I get involved in them all with my opinion but just like other’s opinions, it doesn’t really matter.

The opinion that matters is Michael Beales. I trust him and if he wants kent that’s good enough for me.
 
Wouldn't be too upset if he leaves. But also wouldn’t be against him staying, for the right money and certainly not bursting any wage structure of ours, if we have such a thing. He's a good player is Ryan but just seems to run in to a brick wall too often, in saying that he must be just about the most fouled player in the league, so a lot of the time when he's past a man and looking like doing something he's immediately hacked, must be frustrating for him.
 
I corrected it to twice in 4 season. One of those met the parameters given by the poster by 1 goal. It would seem that the difference between our greatest ever winger and a guy called a ‘chancer’ is a very small margin in terms of stats. Hence the problem with stats.

You must be the most negative guy on here. It genuinely must be a chore supporting us with your outlook.
Why don’t you compare his stats to equivalent players at Celtic. That way you’re comparing attackers from the same era of football in the same league at the same time? No pointless deflections comparing the current against that from the 90’s. You can even compare him to Fashion if you want.

I think it is tough being a Rangers fan just now. Why would I pretend otherwise? Are you enjoying seeing us get dominated? I’ve got to be honest I don’t really like it much. Im quite keen for success.
 
Why don’t you compare his stats to equivalent players at Celtic. That way you’re comparing attackers from the same era of football in the same league at the same time? No pointless deflections comparing the current against that from the 90’s. You can even compare him to Fashion if you want.

I think it is tough being a Rangers fan just now. Why would I pretend otherwise? Are you enjoying seeing us get dominated? I’ve got to be honest I don’t really like it much. Im quite keen for success.
Ok, il compare him to other players of the same era and league. Id have him over abada and maeda. I think its a toss up between him and jota.

Since stats and comparisons of the current era are your thing, i assume you would rather have Blair Spittal, that diddy that got sent off yesterday as he has more goals than kent? Or stevie may? Or if its only assists your after, then kent is ahead of maeda and abada and only 1 behind jota in the same number of games. Duk is miles ahead of all of them if you combine the 2 and there wont be a man alive that takes him over kent.

Also, it is shit not winning trophies. But, i dont ever think its ‘tough’ being a rangers fan. You support your team through thick and thin. Its not a case of only when the win or slate the entire club and all the players when they dont.

We are on track for our second highest points total in god knows how long despite an unbelievable injury crisis killing the league challenge against a Celtic team that have spent 50m and are on track to break the points record completely. Sometimes its not your season.
 
Frankly the comparison with the dark side players is a gross exaggeration of Kent’s weaknesses.
Haksabanovic Abada really.
Firstly I do agree that in terms of goals and direct assists we are looking for more as the bare stats are poor.
However Kent is integral to the style of football we are playing under MB.
His workrate speed and ability to link up with the midfield and Borna are crucial.
I would suggest his actual involvement in goals at some point in the move will be far greater than the actual recorded stats.
If there is one player in our team that they would want us to get rid of it’s Kent I would guess.
In European football the one player which really concerns the opposition is Kent.

Imo he would be extremely hard to replace for what he gives to the team.
There's a lot in your post I agree with. But I'll start with the stuff we disagree on - Firstly, I think the comparison is fair. On pretty much every key stat Ryan Kent is inferior to his closest rival at Celtc, and in some cases even a distant second to Celtc's *third* choice for that position. That's not exaggeration it's fact. Unfortunately.
European performances are a good barometer of a player. Over a 6/8 game run on our UEFA cup final year, I'd agree he looked really good - but looking really good is a subjective measure, these performances are rolled into those stats. This year however, like most of his team mates, he looked awful.
There's a problem with cherry picking games too - We don't get to only play in Europe, and if those are the only games he's shining in the return isn't good enough. We need players who perform reliably, and in domestic competition too - it's our key to European competition.
I get where you're coming from when saying 'I would suggest his actual involvement in goals will be far greater' - Without evidence we have nothing but supposition. Me thinking the earth is flat doesn't make it more likely to be so - and people with empirical evidence can make a far more compelling case in refuting that and proving the earth is round.

The bits I agree with:
I totally agree that players like Kent are integral to Beale's plans for Rangers, and they are also the sort of player that fits the modern game well. If we want success domestically and in Europe we'll need players like that. What I'd say though is this: 'players *like* Kent, but not Kent himself'. By that I meant strong running, direct players with good athletic ability. I like Kent, he's a grafter. He's an excellent professional and never hides. He never gives less than 100%. Crucially though he's just not capable of delivering the standard of football or performance level we need. That's where the stats come in they inform us of the cold hard facts in regard to players - for example, the fact that Kent punched Brown in the face bought him a *lot* of credit with me. It also helps make us blind to his failings because he does things that subjectively we like, but that objectively contribute very little to the team succeeding.
Oddly I agree he'll be hard to replace, but that's got little to do (IMO) with his contribution to the team, the goals and assists (or more pertinently, the lack thereof). He'll be hard to replace because his commitment and work rate are good.

Ajax employ a system for assessing players called TIPS. TIPS are the key elements a player must possess to be a success - Talent, Intelligence, Personality, Speed. Kent has 3 out of the 4. The one he's lacking in is Intelligence. He lacks the judgement needed to make key passes, to set other players up and demonstrably lacks the ability to judge when to shoot.

Kent will leave with my best wishes. I like the guy, I just don't think he's even close to good enough. He can't give the team what it needs.
 
Monster post, so feel obligated to reply :))

As I've explained above, I think the stats don't tell the story of what Ryan contributes to our team. He's at the heart of all of our attacking play, when we're on it. He's back on it under Beale.

I wouldn't swap him for any of the Tims.
Be interesting to know if Beale would?
I'd love to know Beale's thoughts on the players! He's pretty inscrutable at times. His comments on Postecoglu being a case in point. "He's a lucky man' can be regarded as a dig or as a kind of wistful look across the city at the players he's able to buy and the squad depth he's amassed. In that context it's a bit of a compliment rather than labelling him a jammy chancer.
I like that about him, but some insight would be amazing.
 
Ask opposition managers what they think of Kent.When he was confined to the wing during Gios time it wasn't unusual to see 3 players marking him.Beale has the savvy to give him more freedom to work across the front three and sometimes as a number 10.I think he is much more involved and productive under this system and would like to see him stay.
 
Ok, il compare him to other players of the same era and league. Id have him over abada and maeda. I think its a toss up between him and jota.

Since stats and comparisons of the current era are your thing, i assume you would rather have Blair Spittal, that diddy that got sent off yesterday as he has more goals than kent? Or stevie may? Or if its only assists your after, then kent is ahead of maeda and abada and only 1 behind jota in the same number of games. Duk is miles ahead of all of them if you combine the 2 and there wont be a man alive that takes him over kent.

Also, it is shit not winning trophies. But, i dont ever think its ‘tough’ being a rangers fan. You support your team through thick and thin. Its not a case of only when the win or slate the entire club and all the players when they dont.

We are on track for our second highest points total in god knows how long despite an unbelievable injury crisis killing the league challenge against a Celtic team that have spent 50m and are on track to break the points record completely. Sometimes its not your season.
Bullseye
 
Ok, il compare him to other players of the same era and league. Id have him over abada and maeda. I think its a toss up between him and jota.

Since stats and comparisons of the current era are your thing, i assume you would rather have Blair Spittal, that diddy that got sent off yesterday as he has more goals than kent? Or stevie may? Or if its only assists your after, then kent is ahead of maeda and abada and only 1 behind jota in the same number of games. Duk is miles ahead of all of them if you combine the 2 and there wont be a man alive that takes him over kent.

Also, it is shit not winning trophies. But, i dont ever think its ‘tough’ being a rangers fan. You support your team through thick and thin. Its not a case of only when the win or slate the entire club and all the players when they dont.

We are on track for our second highest points total in god knows how long despite an unbelievable injury crisis killing the league challenge against a Celtic team that have spent 50m and are on track to break the points record completely. Sometimes its not your season.
No, im not interested in having SPL dross in my team. Though it says a lot about Kent’s ability to finish and his general form that he’s trailing these players, or that there are scum players who aren’t far off equaling his tally despite Kent having a few extra seasons on them. If anything you’d have been better off not acknowledging the quality of some of the players who’ve managed to outscore him because it doesn’t exactly do him any favours. Everyone knows he has more ability than these guys, but he doesn’t show it very often, isn’t that the crux of the issue and what fans have been complaining about? I mean you’re actually strengthening my argument here. Think about it.

And by the way, my point which I’ve maintained all along, is that while stats and numbers aren’t always indicative of a players performance; they in fact do reflect Kent’s average performance. That’s based on watching him with my own eyes, so your attempt at digging up stats for players who played in a completely different era of football (players who drove us to numerous titles no less) is nonsensical. We’ve seen Kent blow horrendous chances time and again, it’s not an accident that he has so few goals in so many games. Similarly there have been far too many games against SPL dross where you’d barely know he was on the park.

Why would you have Kent over Abada and Maeda if you don’t mind me asking? And why would it be a toss up between him and Jota? Im genuinely curious, because I can’t fathom why someone would rather have a player who hasn’t performed very well or with any consistency over players who’ve waltzed into this league and had a bigger impact on their side, helping them to a title, 2 domestic cups and all but securing a second title. It doesn’t make much sense other than to attempt to appear staunch.

But that’s the thing, I think you are trying to be staunch here. I wouldn’t change my team for anything in the world, but I’m also not going to lie and pretend I don’t find watching us win very little while they hoover up the silverware, absolutely shite. I mean why would any Rangers fan find that anything other than difficult? Are you really suggesting that a fan is less of a fan if they decide they want the squad changed on the basis of the players repeated failures? I’ll support the players in every single game they play, but ultimately I want the best for the club, and if the players aren’t doing it then it’s in the clubs best interests to replace them. Clapping away while we’re failing doesn’t make you a better fan.

I can’t really respond to the last bit. I just find glorifying a points total that won’t win us anything really tragic. Maybe that’s just me though. Not only because we haven’t actually achieved that total yet, but because we’re once again in a position where the league is as good as gone, which changes the entire dynamic and means the players aren’t involved in a pressure filled title race where every game feels like a final. That’s where this team have regularly been found wanting, and that pressure won’t be there now because we’re so far behind. So I have no clue why bealesblueandwhitearmy thinks you’ve proved some sort of point here. I know this is a bit long winded, but it’s as best as I can explain it.
 
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